Quote from: bct_ail on April 20, 2023, 08:18:54 PM

Quote from: Gachapin on April 20, 2023, 03:15:04 PM

Quote from: bct_ail on April 20, 2023, 02:46:26 PM

The MiCA regulation in Europa has passed the votes. It will take effect in 2024.

https://www.coindesk.com/policy/2023/04/20/eu-parliament-approves-crypto-licensing-funds-transfer-rules/

anybody knows if this affects non-custodial wallets and (private) onchain transfers?

You can continue to do what you want. As soon as you use an official money transmitter, you have to do KYC from a transfer sum of €1000.
That is the status today. So what will the future bring? Roll Eyes

The future may well bring a bunch of scofflaw.

Quote from: Gachapin on April 20, 2023, 11:10:01 PM

Quote from: Biodom on April 20, 2023, 08:38:54 PM

Maybe a few people here should read the "First they came" poem by M. Niemoller...
...it's quite relevant despite a multitude of the opposite opinions on this forum.

I learned it in high school, decades ago. It was good life advice for me.

As I understand it, you try to draw a connection between Niemöller's saying and this Bitcoin/shitcoin/Gensler talk, no?

I might get you wrong, but do you wanna imply that Bitcoiners should speak out in favor of shitcoins, like mEth, in order to avoid being the next on the list who the state is coming for ?

If yes, primarily prepare for JJG's batslap Grin

and secondarily I think it's a not so accurate comparison:

Yeah.. I am not totally opposed to some of the points that Biodom is attempting to make, but at the same time, I do see a lot of the shitcoiners trying to suggest variations of their bullshit that "we're in this together" blah blah blah.

At the same time, I do see some various ways that there seems to be some unfairness in the whole matter regarding some of the ambiguities.. I am still not quite clear about solutions.. even though you are likely not going to find me cheering for regulators, either - who seem to be all over the place and have a lot of their own internal contradictions in the ways that they are speaking about matters and going after enforcement while not going after enforcement at the same time (they seem to be in a bit of a pickle.. but I am not really crying about their seemingly pickle, either),... so there is a bit of a dilemma for a lot of us in terms of how to consider the ways of the world and the various ambiguities in confusing transitionary periods like this.

Quote from: Gachapin on April 20, 2023, 11:10:01 PM

The Nazis came for their opponents...
but most shitcoins like mEth are no opponent for the fiat system, because they support exactly the same power structure, (power of the rich) by POS, pre-mine etc.

And.. if Bitcoin is seen as an enemy, it will be so, no matter if shitcoins exist or not. It's not the same animal.

Fair point.. though I don't know if it makes me sleep better. Cheesy

Quote from: Gachapin on April 20, 2023, 11:10:01 PM

Also the Nazis came to put humans into camps or to kill them...
imo inadequate to compare that to regulators who come for illegal ~~securities~~ scams and try to get them registered in a way that any other non-scammy product has to take

However, anyone feel free to vocally support shitcoins in order to save Bitcoin from the state..
But I think that logic is flawed.
It makes only sense, if you are a shitcoiner and don't get the difference between Bitcoin and shitcoins... but even Gensler gets it, what brings me back to my OP

Edit:

Quote from: Biodom on April 20, 2023, 08:38:54 PM

You think he will stop at shitcoins...that's laughable.

maybe I got your writing wrong idk...

I think as for now Gensler stopped at shitcoins, because Bitcoin is no security. And that is good for BTC.
I don't know how he will act in the future.. maybe he will get pressured by "someone" to attack BTC as well... who knows ... I'll be watching Wink

As bitcoiners, we cannot completely detach from these matters, and I am not even opposed to fucking around with shitcoins and gambling with them or making money from them or even attempting to use them to convolute matters - including my own transactions or having transaction options, but I am not going to cry if they are getting beaten up in a variety of ways.. and I am not going to invest into them as if they were the same as bitcoin (like a sound money that has various built in censorship resistances), but even many of us bitcoiners realize that bitcoin has various weak points in which it might overlap with fiat or even end up overlapping with various shitcoins in terms of if we might be transacting with bitcoin but then being precluded from various on and off ramps, and surely one solution might be to figure out some peer to peer mechanism, but there might be various kinds of bridges that might involve shitcoins.. but that still does not mean that it is good to invest in those various shitcoin bridges.. or to promote them.. .. but then at the same time, it still is not going to be exactly straight forward - even when communication channels are sometimes infiltrated.. and some of us might have not even started to experiment with Nostr yet.. (not to be promoting another communication channel, here.... and maybe even the forum might end up having some necessary ties that it might need to make in terms of transitioning in ways that it might not be able to be attacked if we say things that might be threatening to the powers that be that want us to prop up the various Philip (I mean fiat) systems)...