Quote from: 20kevin20 on Today at 03:20:09 PM

Is there no mass adoption yet? When is adoption massive enough for BTC to fit its definition?

Complexity isn’t necessarily a bad thing. It keeps mostly the interested users in BTC. If you aren’t interested in BTC itself, you’re gonna either buy through Revolut or you’re gonna skip the opportunity entirely.

Big players are a double-edged sword. BTC gets recognition but it also gets big players who’re in publicly for obvious reasons - money, and then fame. On the other hand though, it’s gonna be impossible to dimnish wealth inequality. Big players are gonna bite every single opportunity they see.

Good point about what constitutes enough mass adoption. I should have clarified that I am referring to adoption not solely as an investment. This is precisely one of my main concerns. If Bitcoin is predominantly adopted as an investment, what if even those who espouse the Bitcoin philosophy are actually hypocritical players merely waiting for the price to reach a level where they can cash out to fiat? In terms of the Prisoner's Dilemma, if we don't consider the collective well-being of the system, the future is not good.

Quote from: komisariatku on Today at 03:38:50 PM

I think you forgot with "time". Yes, bitcoin takes more time for a new ecosystem to take place. Bitcoin is getting loved by people every day, the community is growing. Maybe now most people keep bitcoin as an asset and expect to profit from the increase in bitcoin prices. But on the way, when many people already have bitcoin then using bitcoin will be the next step. Mass adoption will occur. I think it's still in the introduction stage of bitcoin, there are still many people who don't understand about bitcoin. When the introduction phase is complete, the next phase is transactions using bitcoins, and the final phase is the mass adoption of bitcoins.

I think when the Fiat ecosystem was introduced, many people rejected and did not believe in fiat. You can imagine, gold was replaced with paper, it looks like nonsense. But after a long journey, everyone now believes in fiat and it has been adopted en masse. It's the same with bitcoin, fiat is paper that can be seen and touched whereas bitcoin is digital money that can only be seen on digital devices, that sounds like crap too. So just wait for bitcoin to become a new financial ecosystem, and bitcoin needs "time" to get there

All you say is very reasonable. But how much time do we have? Is the system heading towards the utopia that this logic suggests if we don't correct and influence some behaviors that do not favor that outcome? The ones who are highly motivated to react and influence are the advantage-seeking actors. In the FIAT world, it's evident; in the altcoin world, it's also very evident in most cases, but in Bitcoin, it's more subtle because they camouflage themselves within the philosophy of Bitcoin.

Quote from: piercekieran99 on Today at 05:32:48 PM

You raise a valid concern here. While some established players might appear to be supportive of Bitcoin, they might also inadvertently slow down its progress. It's essential to recognize that these players have their own interests and might not necessarily prioritize the principles that underlie Bitcoin's decentralized nature. As a community, we should actively promote and support new and smaller players in the ecosystem. Encouraging diversity and competition can lead to innovation and ultimately benefit the entire Bitcoin ecosystem. Cool

This point is very important and far from trivial. We should always look at the incentives of the actors involved. It's often more reliable to observe where their incentives lie rather than what they defend in words. I don't believe there is ill will or a conscious effort to harm Bitcoin in the majority of these individuals. Sometimes, it could be mere self-deception.
I think some people (contents creators for instance) take on the role of a believer who positions themselves to "judge" and announce divine punishments for the others, I don't think is beneficial for the system, but for them to engage more followers.

Quote from: lassdas on Today at 05:55:57 PM

Quote from: Drawesome on Today at 02:54:13 PM

If a place doesn't accept Bitcoin, walk away and do not touch your FIAT.

Quote from: Drawesome on Today at 03:21:56 PM

Unfortunately, accepting BTC is the exception, not the rule.

^ Those two don't mix very well ^

I've been asking shops and merchants and service-providers for more than a decade about when they're going to accept BTC,
but guess what? They still don't and I can't even blame them.
Those that do have so few customers to actually use that payment-option, it's not worth the hassle.

Everyone treating Bitcoin just as an investment-asset trying to get rich (preferably quick) doesn't really help in that matter.

In this case, I was mostly thinking about El Salvador. They must accept, and they won't if people don't persuade them by walking away and finding those who do. It's much better to make merchants accept BTC through economic incentives rather than forcing them.

Quote from: hatshepsut93 on Today at 06:05:48 PM

Quote from: Drawesome on Today at 02:54:13 PM

Incentivize Adoption in El Salvador and other local places: If a place doesn't accept Bitcoin, walk away and do not touch your FIAT. If you dealt with an employee , make sure the owner finally knows about the loose. Tourist are not numerous enought to put a pressure here, let's onboard salvadoreans in this.

Have you tried boycotting fiat yourself? You'll very quickly start starving.

Quote from: Drawesome on Today at 02:54:13 PM

Educate and Engage: Let's step out of the comfort zone and educate, give, and promote the entry of new local actors.

Quote from: hatshepsut93 on Today at 06:05:48 PM

Quote from: Drawesome on Today at 02:54:13 PM

Incentivize Adoption in El Salvador and other local places: If a place doesn't accept Bitcoin, walk away and do not touch your FIAT. If you dealt with an employee , make sure the owner finally knows about the loose. Tourist are not numerous enought to put a pressure here, let's onboard salvadoreans in this.

Have you tried boycotting fiat yourself? You'll very quickly start starving.

Quote from: Drawesome on Today at 02:54:13 PM

Educate and Engage: Let's step out of the comfort zone and educate, give, and promote the entry of new local actors.

This would just make Bitcoin look like a religious cult. Good inventions don't need evangelism. No one went door to door to promote television, the Internet or automobile. Poeple rushed to adopt them because they offered a clear advantage.

This would just make Bitcoin look like a religious cult. Good inventions don't need evangelism. No one went door to door to promote television, the Internet or automobile. Poeple rushed to adopt them because they offered a clear advantage.

[/quote]
In this case, I was mostly thinking about El Salvador. They must accept, and they won't if people don't persuade them by walking away and finding those who do. It's much better to make merchants accept BTC through economic incentives rather than forcing them.

Quote from: hatshepsut93 on Today at 06:05:48 PM

Quote from: Drawesome on Today at 02:54:13 PM

Incentivize Adoption in El Salvador and other local places: If a place doesn't accept Bitcoin, walk away and do not touch your FIAT. If you dealt with an employee , make sure the owner finally knows about the loose. Tourist are not numerous enought to put a pressure here, let's onboard salvadoreans in this.

Have you tried boycotting fiat yourself? You'll very quickly start starving.

I don't say it's easy, but at least put some pressure and not just take the VISA and pay in fiat if they say No BTC. For employees, it's easier to say no and not complicate themselves. The one who loose money is the one who is more motivated to do as they must do in a country where they must accept and even they have an easy way to do it.

Quote from: hatshepsut93 on Today at 06:05:48 PM

This would just make Bitcoin look like a religious cult. Good inventions don't need evangelism. No one went door to door to promote television, the Internet or automobile. Poeple rushed to adopt them because they offered a clear advantage.

Bitcoin is not an invention like gunpowder or the steam engine; rather, it is a complex system that evolves depending on the agents that influence it. If the majority of incentives for agents using Bitcoin are speculative, it will be easy to replace it with something else. There is something religious about Bitcoin that makes it unique and irreplicable: its anonymous and selfless creation by Satoshi, as if he were a messiah. Don't engage in evangelism while all others will (scammers, shitcoiners, CBDCs, and Banking 2.0) and wait for the outcome