Quote from: n0nce on Today at 11:46:10 AM

Quote from: DireWolfM14 on August 20, 2023, 02:46:12 PM

What's ironic is that whirlwind seemed like the most legit mixer to pop up in the post CM days, yet here we are.

How did they suddenly become 'the most legit mixer' in just a few weeks or months of operation? In my opinion, trust needs time to build.

I think you misinterpreted my comment, I didn't trust them at all. In fact, I've grown to distrust all mixers, and especially the ones new on the scene. The obvious exception was CM, but they had been around long enough to prove their trustworthiness before I even joined the forum.

The operative word in my comment which you quoted is "seemed." And they did seem legit at first; they developed a unique structure for their mixer, they appeared really committed to their technology, and they seemed excited about their project. The whirlwind account was engaged, approachable, and articulate. It doesn't mean I trusted them, but I did get the impression that, given time, they were the most likely to gain the community's trust the way CM had.

Quote from: n0nce on Today at 11:46:10 AM

Quote from: fillippone on August 20, 2023, 03:33:44 PM

We are all grown up adult here. Financially sovereign individuals. If anyone falls into a scam, it their sole responsibility.

I do fully agree with that. However, you must confess that the reason signature campaigns have requirements such as 'Hero / Legendary member' is because they know higher ranked members pull in more users due to their perceived higher trustworthiness. Or Bitcoin members in general, over e.g. a web banner ad.

It's surely cheaper to just go for 'mass coverage' either through campaigns that accept every applicant and pay a few pennies per post, or through buying banner ads online, if you don't believe that the trustworthiness and reputation of Bitcointalk forum members influences people's business decisions.

The very nature of Bitcointalk signature campaigns means that our reputation and trustworthiness is worth something (the difference between our payouts and a generic web banner ad).
Therefore, I find it incorrect to claim that we have 0 influence over people's decisions by wearing advertising signatures.

I couldn't agree more. This thread is full of deflections and obfuscations from otherwise intuitive people. It seems like there's an effort by many reputable members here to disconnect their own actions from any culpability. On the one hand I don't think there's any need to do so, no one is blaming the sig-campaigners for whirlwind's exit scam so it seems more like a manifestation of their own guilt. But on the other hand, we're all in new and uncharted territory. A forum with it's own internal economy is somewhat unique, and most of us have probably never participated in one before joining here. Couple that with new and developing markets and services within the cryptosphere, and it's enough to confuse the most sophisticated among us. We should be looking at this even as a learning experience and take a more measured approach next time we're faced with a similar situation.

There was a time when buying and selling forum accounts was acceptable, but when it became obvious that many were using purchased account to scam other community members that change was needed. When some start abusing the policies and traditions of the forum, we evolve. There may come a time when we as a community decide that advertising for startup mixers is too high a risk for the community, and the practice becomes unacceptable.

Which brings me back to the comment in my first post in this thread; Mixers are notorious for turning into exit scams. I haven't ran the numbers, but I surmise that more mixers have exit-scammed than any other service that is promoted through sig campaigns on this forum. Now, I don't want anyone to misinterpret me again; I have nothing against mixers, and I'm a firm believer in privacy. I stepped down from a higher paying sig-campaign to advertise for CM because I believed in them and the service they provided. But they are centralized services that can only claim to provide privacy, and we have to trust that they'll do what they claim. And don't get me started on the often claimed but ridiculous provisions of anonymity. No one can assure your anonymity when using an unknown centralized service.