Quote from: ginsan on Today at 09:27:11 AM

Quote from: JayJuanGee on September 29, 2023, 11:12:40 PM

Quote from: ginsan on September 29, 2023, 10:23:35 PM

Quote from: JayJuanGee on September 29, 2023, 12:52:02 AM

There is a power within compounding and exponentials... so if the BTC price is going up through the years, and maybe not very clearly over a few years, but over a cycle or two, you are able to see a kind of stablizing and building upon itself in such a way that after a certain passage of time, it becomes quite difficult to push the BTC price below certain price points.

With all the experiences you have shared, of course it is in accordance with what I said before, where holding BTC for a long period of time promises greater profits. Because it is based on several interesting things regarding the future development of Bitcoin, be it mass adoption or lots of positive news that can make Bitcoin prices rise significantly.

Easier said than done. Unless you have a lot of confidence in your various other investments (so I guess I am speaking towards diversification.. but not into shitcoins), it can be quite difficult to see your investment go up 50x or more, and sure I am not even claiming my own to currently be up more than 27x, since I like to use $1k as my average cost per BTC... .. and so you can imagine that at some point there's gotta be some shaving off, and figuring out how to deal with the volatility without screwing things up.. ....

No, I'm not interested in the word diversification. You seem to imagine that it will be very difficult for us to achieve large profits in the coming years.

I think that you took my points differently than I had intended because I was mostly attempting to describe the various challenges in investing into BTC and also holding for the long term... so "easier said than done" has to do with how difficult it can be to HODL or keep buying or to just have some solid strategies (that could even include some selling on the way up and buy on the way down), especially when profits can sometimes seem to become so great so quickly.

Quote from: ginsan on Today at 09:27:11 AM

I will not attribute income to profits in the short term because I am more interested in doing it in the long term. Volatility is not a reference that will disturb us from always checking the depth of profits every week/month. I don't think we will know for sure how progress will occur in the next year or the next 10 years on the price of Bitcoin. But seeing as the history of Bitcoin always goes up and returns a positive enough Roi for holders in the long term so we are interested in doing it.

I am glad that you have conviction, so that does help to hold through the greatly volatile periods, and for sure, there are no guarantees that bitcoin's price will "always go up."

Quote from: ginsan on Today at 09:27:11 AM

Diversification can always be linked to Shitcoin even if you have denied it.

I have repeated my points of diversification many times, but yes.. shitcoiners use such ideas in order to try to sell their crap... so even if someone might start out ONLY invested in bitcoin and cash, so the only diversification is the level of cash that is held to offset the bitcoin, at a certain point, as our investment into bitcoin grows, and maybe it becomes several times our annual income, we are likely going to need to consider ways to protect ourselves from the extremes of BTC's likely ongoing volatility including realizing that bitcoin's UPpity trajectory is not guaranteed.

how much should we be investing into other asset classes such as property, stocks, bonds, commodities and/or cash/cash equivalents is surely a matter of personal discretion.. but it seems that there is going to be some need to have some assurance that, even if bitcoin does end up going to zero, there is some ownership of other assets.. and/or income sources.. and how much can we keep in cash that we won't end up using to buy bitcoin as its price goes down and we are not sure when such downward fall is going to stop and we could end up running out of cash at some point during some of the bitcoin downity price events.. that surely happen from time to time and maybe more frequently than many of the BTC hodlers would prefer.

Quote from: ginsan on Today at 09:27:11 AM

However, this word still doesn't really make us interested in the mention of diversification that you mentioned.

Just because shitcoiners use it does not mean that we should completely reject the idea. Many people sleep much better when they have some other assets besides having everything in bitcoin.. your choice of assets remains your choice.

Quote from: ginsan on Today at 09:27:11 AM

Yes, maybe we started quite slowly but we will not be easily provoked by a lot of inaccurate words in our train of thought for the long term. One thing I admire is your level of determination in holding Bitcoin for so long and I want to do the same thing you have done.

In late 2013, when I got into bitcoin, I already had a fairly diversified investment portfolio that included several asset classes and even a kind of fund that provided passive income (in the event that I wanted to draw from it or let it fold into itself and/or a certain amount of flexibility involving how much I could draw from it)... so as I was investing into bitcoin, after about a year, I figured out that my allocation would be in the 10% arena as compared with my other quasi-liquid investment portfolio, so even though by the mid-to-end of 2015, I had ended up overallocating into bitcoin in the neighborhood of 13.5%-ish, there were several times, that I had gotten tempted to reallocate some of my traditional investments into bitcoin, and in the end, I refrained from doing it, and I really think that my refraining from putting even more value into bitcoin allowed me a certain level of sanity and also an ability to feel that I could mostly let my BTC portfolio ride when it went from 13.5% to 80%-ish in 2017 and then corrected back down to 45%-ish in 2018 and then went back up to nearly 90% in 2021 and then maybe came back down to 60%-ish in the lows of 2022 and then maybe now it is around 70% to 75%... so those are high percentages that I mostly just allowed to ride through BTC volatility periods mostly because I continued to have the diversification that includes other passive income sources that can be adjusted up or down depending on cashflow needs.

Yeah. my current shitcoin allocation is less than 0.5%.. but still even mostly sitting on those shitcoins, there were some periods in which they exceeded 1%. maybe even including when Bcash became available for bitcoiners, even though I mostly sold mine within a few months .. but still there have been some shitcoins that I have kept in my portfolio.. and I don't really care too much what they do.. and maybe they are there as a kind of alternative way to transact if there were a need make such transactions outside of the dollar or outside of bitcoin.

I like to bash a lot on shitcoins, but I am not even going to blame anyone who invests and screws around with shitcoins who keeps their allocation to some relatively low amount that might even end up getting up to 10% of the size of their bitcoin holdings.. but if they go beyond that, I likely will be more questioning their judgement.. and sure there are likely some honest people who are spending their time on shitcoins, and so surely there are likely some of those folks who are able to justify their approach to time, energies and value invested into shitcoins versus bitcoin, and so I suppose there is a kind of resolution to just accept their choices, even if they are choices that I would not make... and so surely people are free to make those kinds of choices for themselves...and hopefully they are not damaging the world or misleading too many people with their investment allocation choices.