Quote from: Publictalk792 on Today at 03:23:00 AM

Quote from: JayJuanGee on November 28, 2023, 07:18:49 PM

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Basically Bitcoin needs plan. And in my point of view anyone has Bitcoin or he is buying with DCA method so I think he should never sell all the Bitcoins at once. He always hold some amount of Bitcoins. And if anyone will believe on Bitcoin and will Hold for 4-10 years or even more so definitely Bitcoin will give benifits of his/her believing.

Even if you hold bitcoin for 4-10 years it is not definitive that you are going to profit from investing in bitcoin or holding bitcoin for that amount of time.

Time does not cause bitcoin to become a guaranteed investment.

Time should probably anyone in terms of their approach to their investment in terms of if they are thinking about 4-10 years or more into the future before they need their bitcoin, then they might choose to use money that they are not going to need in the next 4-10 years or more. So that means that the money has to be extra money that is beyond expenses and beyond emergency funds.

Another concept that people suggest is to not invest any money that you can afford to lose, and be willing to ride your investment into bitcoin to zero if that is what ends up happening.

Surely some people are investing money that they cannot afford to lose, and that is why they panic if the BTC price moves against them, and surely if you come to bitcoin and you have a price at which you are going to sell all your bitcoin, then that is your choice, even though it does not seem to be a very good idea, because it is probably better to just invest an amount that you would be willing to lose all of it if BTC prices were to go to zero or to go below $20k or whatever lower amount.

Of course all of these kinds of hypothetical and psychological matters are easier to deal with if BTC prices end up going up rather than down, and if you get into profits rather than losses then probably those are "better problems to have."

The problem when the BTC price goes up is that frequently people start selling too much too soon and then they end up not advantaging from the compounding effects as much as they could have... but sometimes it still could be practical to take some value off the table at certain price points, depending on the finances and the psychology of the person if they cannot figure out other ways of dealing with the BTC price going up (and thus the price of their BTC holdings going up).

Quote from: Publictalk792 on Today at 03:23:00 AM

And selling too much earlier is also the personal decision of anyone. But in my point of view if anyone will sell all Bitcoins to soon so he has less knowledge and he needs to learn more about Bitcoin. And definitely he will regret on his decision if he will sell Bitcoin to soon.

Sure. Knowledge might help. But frequently there might be ways that various kinds of finances are in order so that if BTC prices go up, then you have other investments too.. and other places upon which you can draw cash if the BTC price later comes back down. It is not easy to blanketly attempt to judge why any particular person might not be able to tolerate holding BTC as they are going up in price.

Quote from: Publictalk792 on Today at 03:23:00 AM

And Accumulation and selling are two opposite words. If anyone thought that he will accumulate Bitcoin and he selling so definitely he is not accumulating.

Well yes.. but people think that. They think that they are going to sell and then buy back lower, and maybe it works many times, until it doesn't and then maybe they end up in a situation in which they psychologically having difficulties getting back in at BTC prices higher than the price that they sold.. so they might wait longer and longer and longer and then pretty soon turn into a bitter no coiner who used to own bitcoin. Seen quite a few of those kinds of bitter folks over the years.

Quote from: Richbased on Today at 08:33:09 AM

Quote from: Sim_card on November 28, 2023, 10:37:48 PM

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I don't agree to your assertion that it's not ideal to take off profits within the bull run like what's the essence of investing? Isn't it to make profits?

We are not talking about trading and/or short term investing in this thread... So you are wrong. Short term profits is not what is the essence of investing.

You are likely correct that long term profits is the essence of investing .. or even having options by having had invested over the long term and presumably being in profits based on being a long term investor.

Quote from: Richbased on Today at 08:33:09 AM

So in a situation whereby an investor have achieved his major aim of investing which is to make profits so after selling off his bitcoins the next for him to do is to pause investing for sometime until the price begins to dip then he can start buying and holdling again till he aquires a reasonable amount or better still he apply the DCA till the price skyrockets again so that's what an experienced investor does.

You are still mixing up ideas.. and assuming a lot of things.. that seems to mix up trading and investing... an experienced investor does not automatically convert into a trader merely because he has experience.. it is likely that any investor has to figure out how much BTC that he wants to acquire prior to figuring out that he has enough that he is able to sell some of them. If he has not reached his accumulation goals, then he could fuck up his accumulation strategies in a lot of ways if he prematurely tries to trade before he has even gotten close to his BTC accumulation goals.

Another thing you are presuming is an ability to sell the top and buy the bottom, which truly is not easy to accomplish even from someone who is supposedly expierenced.

Quote from: Richbased on Today at 08:33:09 AM

In trading, making profits is not guaranteed all the time so accumulating for a very long period like 10 years as you stated may not really be an obtainable idea as the future is unpredictable no one knows how the fate of the coin might turn out due to some uncertainty that surrounds the ~~stock~~ coin market.

We are ONLY talking about bitcoin in this thread.. so you can use the term bitcoin. and there is no reason to talk about a coin. .because the ideas around coins (meaning shitcoins) is not really applicable to long term investing.. so fuck shitcoins and let's just talk about bitcoin.

Of course, the future is not knowable, and so part of the reason that anyone might start buying bitcoin and had a plan to buy bitcoin for the next 10 years is to potentially have some chances of bringing some certainty and/or hedge to the world as he sees it today as compared with a possible future world... and bitcoin seems to be a good investment and/or hedge and part of the way to hedge is to choose a position size that you believe to be suitable based on your own financial and psychological circumstances... including considering these 9 individual factors.

Quote from: JayJuanGee on December 15, 2021, 02:10:03 AM

These principle individual factors that influence your decision whether to invest into bitcoin and how to invest into bitcoin have financial, skills and psychological components that include:

1)   your cashflow,

2)   how much bitcoin you have already accumulated,

3)   your other investments (including cash reserves),

4)   your view of bitcoin as compared with other investments,

5)   your timeline,

6)   your risk tolerance,

7)   your time, skills, goals (investment/lifestyle targets, which includes figuring out the extent that you are in BTC accumulation, maintenance or liquidation stage),

8 )   your abilities to strategize, plan, research and learn along the way including tweaking strategies from time to time,

9)   your considering your time, your abilities and whether to trade, reallocate from time to time, to use of leverage and/or to use financial instruments... (and for sure the use of financial instruments, leverage and margin trading involve higher level skills and are not even necessary to still become richie in bitcoin's already existing asymmetric bet.)

Quote from: Richbased on Today at 08:33:09 AM

Making accumulation for a very long period of time might even lead to losses because in the quest of hoping that the price will skyrocket then it suddenly starts dipping so it's really not ideal to accumulate for too long as no one can speculate or predict what it's future holds.

You sound like you are not capable of long-term investing.

Maybe if you consider position size, then that might help you to get over the hump of longterm investing versus feeling that you need to cash out merely because you have some profits.

Yes.. we do not know what the future holds, but that does not necessarily mean that we should not invest, or that we should consume instead.

Maybe an example is necessary, and let's try to go by your forum registration date of less than 5 months ago.. or maybe we can presume you been into bitcoin for a year, so if you had been accumulating bitcoin for a year at $100 per week, and so after a year you got up to $5,200 invested into bitcoin. and let's say that you had some bad luck and your average cost per BTC is around $30k. So let's say that there is a bull run and the BTC price goes to $90k with the next 9 months, and so then you have 3x the amount that you started with or maybe 200% profits (So you have $15,600). You are going to sell? and buy back lower.. or you will buy back lower 1/2 and use the other half for some kind of fun vacation or a car. Or do you have some other plans for your proceeds?

I am having some trouble understanding the idea how you are better off because you sold your $30k BTC at $90k and then you actually have to figure out what you are going to do with it. .. wait to buy back and then you are a no coiner? or maybe you only sell half of it for the purpose of buying back? What's your advice as a newbie who should be trying to accumulate BTC and if you merely have less than 0.2 BTC, then it can be difficult to see how you would be advantaged to either become a low coiner or even a no coiner merely because you worship fiat or some consumption goods since you never know about the future, right?.. would not want to hold onto that less than 0.2BTC until 2033

Quote from: Moreno233 on Today at 08:49:28 AM

Quote from: Sim_card on November 28, 2023, 10:37:48 PM

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I was having this mindset before, thinking that it was never a good practice to sell Bitcoin. But when I join this discussion, I realized there were actually people that sold around the peak of 2021 bull run and started building back their portfolio during the following bear market even up this moment many of them are still buying. How they got such information about the market cycle and how they developed such level of discipline to follow it is what one need to study. The key point is that, there should be a way of selling that will not harm the entire portfolio especially when you sell not because you want to use the money for other things or waste it away but because you are being strategic and poised to maximizing profits.

On a second thought, selling does not harm Bitcoin all the time because without buying and selling, what is the use of Bitcoin? Indeed, it is through selling and buying that liquidity is created so we should not demonize selling. Just that one should be be able to plan the selling in such a way that it align with your visions and your motivation for investing in Bitcoin in the first place.

We are not really talking about that here.

If you are saying that your goal is to accumulation, you want to proclaim that selling is the way that you do it, but that is not the topic of this thread. Maybe you should take your ideas to another thread so at least you will be on topic in your planning of a strategy for the upcoming anticipated bullmarket.

According to your forum registration, you have been a member for more than 2 years. So have you been accumulating BTC more than 2 years?

you think that you are going to help your BTC holdings by selling rather than buying and then you are going to figure out how to do that and then how to buy back during a supposed dip that will follow some time after you sell your coins.

Quote from: Justbillywitt on Today at 04:25:09 PM

Quote from: JayJuanGee on November 28, 2023, 07:18:49 PM

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I have learned so much from you and others who has contributed. I must say I have a great respect for you. It is only a man that is not willing to grow that will not take correction when he/she is going the wrong way. Clearly from your explanations I have now realized that my approach in my bitcoin accumulation was wrong and I have to make adjustment towards and make use of DCA while I continue my bitcoin accumulation.

Really? It will be interesting to hear what your revisions might become once you make them. In the end, each of needs to try to tailor to our circumstances to our own finances and psychology, so hopefully, you are in a better position to be able to do that.. and to put yourself in a stronger financial/psychological situation because of your actions. So ultimately if you fuck it up, don't come crying to me about it, because whatever you do, ultimately, it is your decision and your responsibility for whatever changes, if any, you end up making.

Quote from: SmartGold01 on Today at 06:01:45 PM

Quote from: Justbillywitt on Today at 04:25:09 PM

I have learned so much from you and others who has contributed. I must say I have a great respect for you. It is only a man that is not willing to grow that will not take correction when he/she is going the wrong way. Clearly from your explanations I have now realized that my approach in my bitcoin accumulation was wrong and I have to make adjustment towards and make use of DCA while I continue my bitcoin accumulation.

I still think most people don't understand the sole purpose of DCA, You can involved in DCA if you don't have that much funds for instantaneously buying a very large volume of bitcoin, DCA is also play in when you seems not to be too sure about the market maybe price is going low or going high but you don't want to miss any given opportunity because you might be left behind or leave to regret why you bought huge amount of bitcoin without Buying it within some period of space or interval.

Further more, It could be that your money in quest doesn't regularly flows maybe it comes one in a week/Bi-week or monthly it could be in every 3 months to 6 months provided that money is coming along this period you can involved yourself with doing DCA by buying when the money comes and before that you need to have some spare cash at hand whereby you won't keeps reducing the amount of bitcoin you hold and that is in your possession this process can be called the accumulation period or process. So don't know the narration of how people are seeing the DCA strategy maybe there is other things you are seeing and taking this DCA to be.

For sure, you are correct in your characterization of DCA as a kind of way to tailor the amount that you are buying bitcoin in accordance with your own budgetary matters (how much extra cash flow that you have), and not so much about whatever the BTC price might be, and sure DCA will excel even more if you don't really know which direction the BTC price might go as compared to if you believe that the BTC price might be in a dip or in a high period, then you might decide to move away from DCA, even though DCA could still work in those situations too because even when you think you know, you might not really know, so it ends up being better to just continue following DCA until you figure out some other target and goal matters that might be more appropriate triggers to cause you to modify your DCA rather than trying to figure out whether the BTC price is going to go up or down.