Quote from: arwin100 on December 17, 2023, 10:05:35 AM

Quote from: JayJuanGee on December 15, 2023, 08:10:43 PM

Quote from: arwin100 on December 15, 2023, 11:45:46 AM

Quote from: JayJuanGee on December 14, 2023, 06:44:25 PM

Exactly.. a person (newbie into bitcoin/investing) can start out by dedicating 5% to 10% of his income into the investment, and after a few years increase that to higher amounts.. but surely if it remains unfeasible to increase the investment amount to more than 5% to 10%, then such person should just do what he can, and even 5% to 10% will likely add up, even though 5% is likely only equivalent to having had invested a whole year's salary after 20 years of employing such strategy, but 10% has chances of having invested a whole year's salary after 10 years.. and sometimes these higher levels of aggressiveness (when possible) can make really stupendous kinds of differences in therms of the progress made and how the quantities might add up to significant, meaningful and potentially life-changing amounts.

That's actually good figures to invest but knowing newbies they don't easily go with long term investment that's why they also need to experience first how to trade well in the market and after that for sure they would realize that Hodl is so good for anyone and for that they can start this 5% or `10% part of their salary for their investment.

I don't see how trading is going to help anyone to potentially build up their BTC holdings in a faster way, and probably one of the better ways to increase their BTC holdings and their abilities to reach 1 year's salary invested in a shorter period of time is to increase income and/or cut expenses.

Sure, if someone has no realistic ways to increase his/her income and/or job possibilities, then maybe in those kinds of circumstances, there could be some value in learning trading.. but I still have my doubts, especially when it comes to bitcoin. Bitcoin is amongst the best of asymmetric Upward opportunities that any of us have (if not the best), so why would we want to be fucking around with it and trying to trade it? That hardly makes any sense, and surely if trading bitcoin, then there is some needs to learn about bitcoin, but if trading shitcoins, then there would be needs to learn about that crap, including likely a lot of distracting and not even good kinds of information... especially if you are attempting to learn about pumping and dumping and market sentiment and a lot of that dumb stuff..

Maybe it can help if they do good trades and earn some profit from their daily trading activities

Why are you continuing to pursue this dumb idea? We are not talking about trading here, and probably for an overwhelming majority of normal people, they neither have skills or time for trading, so why employ a more advance technique when it is not necessary.. You are merely complicating matters by 1) suggesting trading is a good thing and 2) even suggesting that trading is something that is needed to know prior to getting into bitcoin... You are suggesting the opposite of the truth, and I wonder why? Do you even recognize and appreciate that trading is a more advance technique? Why are you promoting trading as if it were a less advance technique? I feel like I am repeating myself.

Quote from: arwin100 on December 17, 2023, 10:05:35 AM

but its really hard to achieve this since we provably face a lot of stress due to unpredictability of the market that's why beginners should never play with this if they are new especially if they are eager to get profit since for sure they will just get burned for their wrong expecting and executing some wrong actions.

Yes.. they get burned by trading, but not by investing.

if they invest, they just pick a position size, such as investing $100 per week or some other amount. And sure they could also lump sum invest (such as front-load into bitcoin) or buy on dips, but it is likely best to start out with the most basic and build their way up to more complicated techniques after they first get used to getting into bitcoin. Some people have more knowledge and experiences in regards to investing and managing their cashlfow so that they are able to invest, so if they are new to investing, then they might have to learn some of the basics of just managing their cashflows, but they can learn those kinds of basic things as they regularly continue to build a bitcoin position.. and they might be building a bitcoin position for 4-10 years or longer.. so does not hurt to try to study aspects of bitcoin and to get used to bitcoin as they are buying it and even learning where and how to store their BTC...and so in the very beginning they might not need to know as much about where and how to store their BTC, but if they invest a lot or they continue to build their bitcoin investment portfolio, then they may well need to learn more about the various ways to securely store their coins, including figuring out ways to manage their own BTC private keys rather than having their BTC held with third parties.

Those learnings of how to store and secure your coins are likely more important skills than learning about trading.... and no one should want to trade something as potentially valuable as bitcoin.. best thing is to build it up, and surely if they get to a large enough BTC stash in the future, then maybe they might choose to fuck around (and trade) with some small portion of their BTC, such as less than 10% of their BTC holdings.

Quote from: arwin100 on December 17, 2023, 10:05:35 AM

But since we all see how bitcoin grows and show this is for long term much really better for anyone to invest for this coin for long term since it can save them from stress and time for always there monitoring the market movements.

Sure, the more that people buy into BTC, then they may well become concerned over changes in value, but they also can look at past charts and see that bitcoin has a history that includes a lot of price volatility that is likely not going to stop any time soon.

Quote from: arwin100 on December 17, 2023, 10:05:35 AM

Newbie should learn to acquire some skills and patience since this could give them real profit if they learn to hold for long term since if they always there for short term for sure there's nothing gonna happen on their investment as they remain eating chunks.

We can only see that pumping dumping scheme on shitcoins so maybe people usually go there for short term only especially those what so called skilled trader but for newbie they should know the risk for trading and following someone investing since for sure they would provably get drought and lose their money which they think before to use for investment in bitcoin.

Ultimately a person has to figure out his own investing style and how much to invest into bitcoin without it causing him to become overly emotional about it, and surely there can be some benefits towards investing somewhat aggressively and maybe being able to deal with negative BTC price performance by having some kinds of buying plans.. whether it is buying on dips or just continuing to buy BTC for several years while building a BTC investment portfolio, and depending upon how much they are investing, such as if they are investing 10% to 25% of their income into BTC, then they may well establish a decently-sized bitcoin position faster than if he might be investing only 1% t0 5%, then it will take a lot longer to build a decently sized BTC investment position.

Quote from: Publictalk792 on December 17, 2023, 01:48:51 PM

Quote from: JayJuanGee on December 16, 2023, 08:12:58 PM

[edited out]

But if anyone using the DCA method so I think this is the best strategy which should not be changed. If anyone want to change strategy so this is better he/s should make a new plan of investment.

DCA tends to be a good strategy for someone building a position and if they are not sure what to do or how to get exposure to BTC, and they might not even be sure how long they are going to keep investing into BTC or to continue to hold their position.

Even though DCA tends to be amongst the best BTC accumulation strategy for an overwhelming majority of people, anyone can adapt their BTC accumulation approach based on spending time to learn more about ways to employ other strategies, but if they are somewhat new to building a BTC position, and maybe even if they do not have money that they can transfer to bitcoin from other places, they may well be better off to employ strict forms of DCA or mild variations of DCA that is largely just adapting to their cashflow situation.

If someone builds up his bitcoin position fast by either lump summing into bitcoin or maybe just drawing a high percentage of their salary to buy bitcoin, they might put themselves into a position in which they might want to combine DCA with buying on dips or maybe even convert into buying on dips, and it can be difficult to know when someone might be better off to convert to some other strategy, because if someone ONLY invests into bitcoin, there may be some needs to diversify into other investments, especially once their bitcoin investment starts to reach a year or even several years of their annual salary, and there could likely be circumstances in which it makes sense to start to diversify into other investments even before having had accumulated a whole years salary into bitcoin.

Quote from: erep on December 17, 2023, 05:01:47 PM

Quote from: Publictalk792 on December 17, 2023, 01:48:51 PM

By the way you are also right it can hard to know the information about Bitcoin is trusted or not. Some sources give wrong information... but there is good sources too that teach us important things. It might take time to figure out... which sources is good but it is important to stay inform and look for trusted sources.

Every information you get from any source must be identified as the initial source of information, so don't trust the source of information without checking the truth of the information on other information sources, don't even completely trust bitcoin information on website sources, some negative news on the crypto market without a clear source and their media often publish news based on assumptions to influence panic during market corrections. In my opinion, the only trusted sources of information are the Bitcointalk, Telegram and X forums, but it must come from a trusted account.

Of course, it is good to develop good critical thinking skills, which largely would mean that we need to be able to sort better kinds of information from worse kinds of information, so many statements will have facts, logic (analysis) and conclusions (opinions), so we can question the sources of information in regards to any of those whether they are providing good facts, logic and/or conclusions.. and so when we are new to a topic, we might have more difficulties figuring out if the facts are being described correctly, sometimes, we will have to learn skills to be able to determine if the logic is sound and if they logic leads to the conclusions that are reached.

Trusted sources do help, especially when we are new to a topic, but sometimes trusted sources are not correct on all topics... sometime we can also compare various trusted sources, and even compare them with untrusted sources (to the extent that we are willing to get distracted by spending time reading and/or analyzing untrusted sources who sometimes do present accurate information on some topics)... and sometimes we also have to forum our own conclusions based on various opinions, and sometimes we cannot find anyone who might speak to exact topics or issues that we personally need to resolve, and we may well need to take a position (or take some kind of action and come to our own conclusions, and sometimes if we are not sure, then we might moderate the position/action that we take).

Quote from: erep on December 17, 2023, 05:01:47 PM

Quote from: Publictalk792 on December 17, 2023, 01:48:51 PM

But if anyone using the DCA method so I think this is the best strategy which should not be changed. If anyone want to change strategy so this is better he/s should make a new plan of investment.

The DCA method is very effective for realizing the crypto investment

We are ONLY talking about bitcoin, so fuck shitcoins.

DCA does not necessarily work on shitcoins, especially since there may well not be any shitcoins that have an investment thesis that is strong enough in order to invest into them. You have to have a strong investment thesis in order for DCA to be justifiable... which works iwth Bitcoin.. and yes, bitcoin is the topic of this thread.. not shitcoins or crypto.. whatever the fuck that is.

Quote from: erep on December 17, 2023, 05:01:47 PM

that you have planned according to your individual finances. I think if they choose another method it is very risky for the unpredictable crypto market, so we don't need to look at other methods but we can combine the DCA method with Another investment method to be able to handle the risk of loss, according to the topic title "Buy the Dip, and Hold!" is an important part of the DCA method, so investors or traders who apply the DCA method have planned to save reserve funds to increase investment at the DIP price, and they will hold for the long term until they reach ATH 2024.

We are not trading here either... so long term might not be 2024 unless maybe you have been investing since 2020 or earlier, and maybe if you have a 4-10 year or longer investment time horizon, you still might not be necessarily looking at selling in 2024 or 2025 or whenever the ATH comes, but it is surely nice to be getting BTC prior to the next ATH, so I will agree with you about the benefits of buying BTC prior to the next ATH, to the extent that you were potentially talking about BTC rather than shitcoin or crypto, whatever that might be.. we could give less than two shits about other coins.. so we are ONLY talking about bitcoin here, in this thread.

Quote from: ginsan on December 17, 2023, 09:09:30 PM

The best thing is to buy and keep holding and don't sell all your BTC holdings if you are in an economic crisis, sell just a little and when your economy recovers you can budget back funds to continue buying BTC.

You should always try to create enough of an emergency fund that accounts for your variation in your cashflow or even emergencies that might happen so that you should never have to sell any of your BTC, except at a time that is completely of your own choosing, such as the BTC prices are going up or even that you have been holding BTC for a long enough time that you have transitioned from your accumulation stage to your maintenance stage.

So, the more that you know in advance that you might have emergencies, the more you should know that you should not be investing into bitcoin in such a way that bitcoin is going to have to be a source of emergency funds for you. These kinds of emergency fund matters are more important to beginner investors, and very beginner investors might not have even thought about having an emergency fund, and frequently the lack of an emergency fund is a sign that the person has failed/refused to plan and probably has overinvested into bitcoin, which is not a good position to be.

I personally believe that the lack of an emergency fund should not serve as a reason to NOT invest into bitcoin, but a person who is beginning to invest into bitcoin, might have to keep his investment into bitcoin at a smaller level while he is building up the size of his emergency fund, and an emergency fund should be between 3 months to 6 months salary/expenses, and the more solid a person's emergency fund, the more aggressive that he can afford to be in his bitcoin investment and/or any other investment that he chooses to make.

By the way, if a person has reached entry-level fuck you status, or even higher than that (such as multiple levels of fuck you status), his emergency fund becomes less important. Reaching fuck you status just means that the person does not have to work, and maybe he chooses to work, but he does not have to. Anyhow, if a person has considerable amount of wealth that he is able to draw from the wealth on a regular basis to pay for his monthly expenses, then if an emergency comes, maybe he has money that is set aside for an emergency fund, but it might not matter very much if his wealth is excessive, so his emergency fund is less critical to maintain (in terms of getting reckt financially/psychologically) as compared with a newer investor who is earlier in his building up of his investment portfolio. The earlier you are, the more important it is to have an emergency fund, and not to get reckt because you were to greedy to be investing money that you actually needed for your expenses and for your failure/refusal to establish an emergency fund.