Quote from: Fuso.hp on Today at 06:13:49 AM

Quote from: Odohu on January 28, 2024, 08:42:12 PM

He will not hesitate to sell if that price is even achieve in a month from the point of investment. We can call this long term investment if it happens that he sold shortly after buying because he achieved the target selling price.

Long-term investments are generally made with a specific time frame in mind. For example, if an investor invests himself in a five-year plan and the market price changes significantly during these five years, and despite this change, the investor holds the investment for a certain period of time without selling the investment, this is long-term investment. If the investor thinks that he buys Bitcoin for $1000 and he sells it when he gets $200 on his investment, but here he has a business objective of making a certain amount of profit. Since his investment in this case depends on a certain amount of profit, if we consider his method as a businessman, then we may not be wrong. If the investment is made with the intention of holding the investment in depth, one must try to hold the investment for a certain period of time.

You sound mixed up regarding what is "long term investing," and you may well not have any kind of specific timeline for when to get out exactly, even though you might have some ideas in regards to when you might start to need the money, whether that is 4-10 years or further into the future.

Sure having some specific goals into the longer term, such as 5 years or wanting to reach a certain amount, could have some relationships to long term or maybe overlap with the idea of long term or difficult to achieve goals that may or may not be reached... so some of the ways that you are framing long term could also fit within the category of long term thinking about investing.. . but you do not have to have any of those kinds of specifics...

You could have long term plans and intentions to stay with your investment 4-10 years or longer, while also recognizing that you have discretion to change your mind at any time or that you might want to make sure that you always have some ways of exiting the investment, even if you are not planning to exit, but you want to make sure that you can exit if you feel that you need to (or change your mind and want to).

Of course, you are less likely to be successful in your investment if you end up pulling out early.. so there is a lot of power in making sure that you can stay in.. but surely you also have complete autonomy over your own life and your investments, even if you end up screwing it up.. .. and there even could be some rare scenarios that getting out ended up being the right thing to do.

Quote from: Odusko on Today at 07:05:15 AM

Quote from: JayJuanGee on Today at 02:57:18 AM

Quote from: wendty on January 28, 2024, 11:45:45 AM

Indeed, for people who are optimistic about bitcoin, choosing a buy the dip and HOLD strategy is a good strategy to add to their portfolio. However, as an investment strategy, of course, buying the dip must be accompanied by controlling risk. One of them is by determining the target selling price when we buy when the price drops.

The topic of this thread is built upon a presumption of long term investing, and we are not trading here or even selling for short term profits and/or expectations to buy back lower.

if your investment plan is 4-10 years or longer, you are likely going to have better chances of experience compounding of your invested amount and also you will likely increase your options regarding what you might want to do with your bitcoin investment later down the road, especially if you both hold and invest more than one whole cycle... notice the thread topic also says nothing about selling, and that is on purpose (rather than an accident).

Bitcoin investment cycle should be aimed at long term investment because that os the only way to fully accumulate all the variables that usher in good profits, and yes indeed our focus in this topic is based on that fact, but most time, young upcoming investors who may not have the cashflow to hold they Bitcoin for that 4-10 year long term bitcoin investment cycle, because they are forced at some point to sell their Bitcoin to solve one problem or the other, or even applying the DCA approach so as to increase their capital with the thought that buying low and selling high based on short-term speculation could help the to achieve a more financially stable position, those set of Bitcoin investors will always speak based of their mindset and position, even though that, on the long run, the maximize profits in that practice cant match up with the one that comes along with just holding your Bitcoin for that space of time without doing any action either to sell with the intention to buy back at low which is what most call DCA approach.

There could be scenarios that someone heavily DCAs on a weekly basis for the first 2-4 years invested into bitcoin, and then the next 2 years DCA's less frequently (maybe every 2-4 weeks) and buys on dips.. and then maybe the next 2 years DCAs about once a quarter and continues to buy on dips.. and then maybe the next 2 years only DCAs about once or twice a year and buys on dips and maybe thereafter ONLY buys on dips and rarely DCAs. So after about 10 years, he has coins that have various levels of cost basis and surely his earliest coins have compounded in value the most and some of his later coins might or might not be profitable... and if they are profitable may still be less than 100% in profits... so maybe if the guy might consider changing his strategy into something in which he might start to sell some coins or sell on the rips and buy on the dips or even just set up a budget in which he is cashing out a bit every month, perhaps less than 4% per year of his stash, but he may reach higher levels of stages of his BTC investment in which he ends up moving more and more away from regular buying and perhaps starts to include various forms of selling that may or may not involve attempts to strategize sells around the price.. and optional whether he buys any back or not... but he has more and more options the longer he is in and the longer that some of his earlier purchased coins come into higher levels of profits, which is also not guaranteed to happen, but if we invest in such a way that we are not worried about the money, we will find out the extent to which our options might have ended up increasing in regards to how long we had been accumulating BTC and in various ways over the years.

Quote from: Wind_FURY on Today at 08:49:23 AM

Quote from: Moreno233 on January 27, 2024, 01:18:05 PM

--Snip--

I was actually thinking about what you posted, and you may be right. Perhaps it shouldn't be how much a person could purchase now, and chase life-changing gains. Bitcoin is more about self-sovereign ownership of our own assets, freedom, and censorship-resistance, NOT entirely to get rich. Although getting rich and doing that with Bitcoin would be nice.

Remembering the ethos upon which the foundation of Bitcoin was built on, then DCA, buy at any price NOW if you can is probably what people should do.

Your first paragraph is especially a good framing Wind_FURY.

In that regard, bitcoin provides us with a lot of various kinds of empowerment that is not merely about getting rich - even though getting rich seems to have had historically been an additional benefit that people have been receiving by building their BTC stash and mostly HODLing their BTC stash through many years.

Some people only come for the get-rich part of bitcoin and they are focused on the getting rich part and not even giving any shits about the empowering part, and surely some of these people will evolve in their thinking and understanding of bitcoin, but some of them will never get over the mere monetary focus, which I suppose in several senses if still valid, even though it is incomplete and somewhat superficial way of thinking about and understanding bitcoin... ..

even though as long as we keep building and holding our BTC, we can have very good chances of being able to end up doing both, too.. whether our original intentions had been exclusively on one or another, it still seems that both will continue to play out in the coming years.. and there are some who even say that it is inevitably based on math, even though many of us realize that it is not inevitable, yet bitcoin is a pretty amazingly designed system.. that is likely to persist and even to go up in value, which surely makes it more beneficial to any individuals to be sure to employ consistent, persistent, ongoing and perhaps even aggressive (without over doing it) accumulation strategies.

Quote from: oppophonebox00 on Today at 09:27:46 AM

Those who want to hold Bitcoin for the long term must keep a close eye on the crypto market. Whenever you see a dip in Bitcoin price in the crypto market, you will try to buy and hold Bitcoin. But I know that Bitcoin will pump multiple times in the next few years. .Now bin our time and expect to earn multiple times in a few years from now.

Fuck shitcoins.

You do not look at the tail to figure out what the dog is going to do.. you look at the dog to figure out what the tail is going to do.

In other words the dog wags the tail, not the other way around.

In other words, shitcoins are almost completely irrelevant to long term BTC investing ideas, even though they might have affects on short term BTC price moves in terms of creating drama or other various affinity scams that they are involved in on a regular basis... Keep your eye on the prize and be careful in terms of how much you are allowing nonsense to distract you.

Quote from: I_Anime on Today at 10:22:49 AM

Quote from: Odohu on Today at 09:58:46 AM

Quote from: oppophonebox00 on Today at 09:27:46 AM

Those who want to hold Bitcoin for the long term must keep a close eye on the crypto market. Whenever you see a dip in Bitcoin price in the crypto market, you will try to buy and hold Bitcoin. But I know that Bitcoin will pump multiple times in the next few years. .Now bin our time and expect to earn multiple times in a few years from now.

On the contrary holding Bitcoin for long does not require you to keep a close eye on the market. There are certain conditions that will enable you hold Bitcoin for long and monitoring the price is never one of them. As a matter of fact, if you have your eyes glued to the market, monitoring the price, you are setting yourself up for emotional torture and the temptation of selling quick.

To be able to hold Bitcoin for long, first calculate your basic expenses check if your income is enough to cover it and still keep some balance, part of which you will invest in Bitcoin and keep the other part for any emergency expenditure that will come up any time within the period you are buying the Bitcoin.

To achieve this, how you buy the Bitcoin is very important. I mean, you can chose a method of buying Bitcoin which is call DCA, it require you to be investing a certain amount you have calculated to be fine for you to put in Bitcoin without putting your self under pressure. This amount can be invested weekly or monthly into Bitcoin as the case may be. If you are not comfortable with this method, you can just buy Bitcoin anytime you have the finances but the most important thing is that you must invest only what you can afford to leave in Bitcoin for a long time without being affected in any way.

monitoring the market movement on a regular, won't be encouraging ones yah seeing your portfolio going down due to a certain dip the mindset of you selling would be initiated. Like when bitcoin dip to the price range of $38k I didn't bother checking my portfolio I just keep on accumulating more bitcoin, because you monitoring it always yah just testing your emotions. And beside not even thinking of withdrawing this year I may start atlest around the year of 2025 that why I'm actually focusing on learning more about this [ANN] JJG Sustainable Bitcoin Withdrawal Strategy. so that when I'm ready I would make use of this strategy

Be careful in terms of trying to employ various sustained withdrawal strategies too early, since it is not intended to be a trading strategy... also it likely is good to be in bitcoin for at least a cycle and a half for your earliest of coins to likely start to compound the most in value.. so there is value in terms of getting compounding effects in your BTC holdings prior to starting to withdraw coins... but if you believe that you have reached your own level of fuck you status, then maybe in the west that would be $2 million in value and $6,666 in value of withdrawal per month or maybe in some other place, you could feel good with 1/10th that amount which is $200k and that would be $666 per month.. which does not seem like entry level fuck you status to me, but surely I understand that it could be entry-level fuck you status for some folks...and if you were to employ conservative levels of withdrawal, it is likely that your withdrawal amounts (in terms of their dollar value - (especially their 200-week moving average value) would most likely continue to go up.

So for example right around a 6.6 BTC amount of BTC holdings would currently give you right around $200k in value in terms of the spot price, and at a 4% withdrawal rate which would likely end up allowing the BTC value to continue to grow faster than your withdrawal rate, you would be authorized to withdraw 0.022BTC per month and as you withdraw the withdraw amount will slowly go down but it still could be sustainable (and even growable) for many folks to withdraw at that 4% per year rate. https://bitcoindata.science/withdrawal-strategy ...

The punchline still is going to be to be careful to not start to withdraw before you really have built up your bitcoin level to a stash that you are comfortable, because if you do start to withdraw, then you should mostly be presuming that your BTC holdings are going to continue to shrink in size, even if you might have some opportunities to buy back BTC with some of the proceeds that you had received in your selling BTC and the tool will even suggest to sell several months in advance at various stages when the BTC price is at various levels of percentages higher than the 200-week moving average, so for example if the BTC price is 14x higher than the 200-week moving average, the tool authorizes (and even suggests) that you might consider selling up to 59 months of your monthly authorized budget in advance, but for example, we would still need to use some common sense because if you had already sold 23 months in advance when the 59 months in advance prices were to be triggered, then you would ONLY have a remaining 36 months (59-23) in advance that you would be able to sell, yet I still would not consider the tool to be trading tool even though many of us likely realize that if we were to sell 59 months in advance, there may well both be difficulties in spending that amount of money in 59 months, but also we likely are going to realize that the BTC price does not likely stay at those kinds of high levels for long periods of time, so it is quite likely that within the next couple of years there would be opportunties to use some of the advance months to buy back some months and to be able to use the tool with higher balances that result from buying back months. and then you would also be able to continue to cash out within the guidelines of the sustainable withdrawal system once the months are bought back and reviving your ability to use the system... so maybe a lot of this sounds complicated because the tool provides guidance, but you still have to keep track of your own actions and the level that you had used the withdrawal amounts or that you had bought back some of the months or maybe buying back all of the months that were still remaining for you to budget yourself.

And maybe my main point, along with the theme of this thread is to make sure that you have accumulated enough BTC before you start fucking around with trying to trade.. and it surely would become more likely to become more apparent how to treat your BTC stash and holdings once it starts to get to a size that you could start to employ some kind of sustainable withdrawal, an the sustainable withdrawal tool is to help to give guidances regarding how to not overdo your level of withdraw, and if you error on the side of being someone conservative when you start to use the tool but also conservative in your settings of how much that you permit yourself to withdraw, it may well end up being the case that the value in the holdings will continue to grow while you are withdrawing and you would be able to withdraw at more aggressive rates later down the road. and maybe still staying within parameters to keep the portfolio sustainable perhaps even in perpetual ways, in part depending on if the BTC price continues to cooperate with historical assumptions or there may need to be some adjustments to the assumptions if BTC price dynamics change in the coming years.

Quote from: Richbased on Today at 01:22:28 PM

Quote from: Fara Chan on January 28, 2024, 08:16:01 PM

Quote from: wendty on January 28, 2024, 11:45:45 AM

Indeed, for people who are optimistic about bitcoin, choosing a buy the dip and HOLD strategy is a good strategy to add to their portfolio. However, as an investment strategy, of course, buying the dip must be accompanied by controlling risk. One of them is by determining the target selling price when we buy when the price drops.

I think for those who really like Bitcoin and also really like implementing the buy the dip and HOLD strategy, there is no need to determine a selling price target very early if the purpose of buying on the dip itself is for long-term investment. Because those who usually determine the selling price very early or after successfully making a purchase at a dip price are traders and this will certainly not be the same as investors who like to hold Bitcoin in the long term. Although they all also consider risk control when doing something in the market.

Actually, an investor can't really determine the selling price targets when they want to buy and hodl for a long interval of time but however if an investor who buys when the dips occur can't actually resell at that material time regardless of if his gonna make a little profit but rather he can hodl his coin in his portfolio and allow the price to skyrocket then his investment would be matured enough for him to sell off his coin but moreover, a good investor doesn't sell all his coins as he can still leave some coin in his portfolio should in case the price goes further high instead of selling it off and waiting for a dip to buy of which a dip might never occur Again.

These are decent points about any decisions to sell when a person is wanting to get more BTC should be considered in light that the price might not ever drop back down, so usually the sell amounts would be relatively small, especially if a person is in BTC accumulation stages, and any one still accumulating is going to end up feeling quite uncomfortable if he sells some BTC but the price keeps going up and then he is accumulating a lot of cash and feeling a need to buy, so he ends up buying way higher than his earlier sell price.

Quote from: Moeda on Today at 05:04:42 PM

Quote from: AjithBtc on April 17, 2019, 10:34:07 AM

With bitcoin as well rest of the altcoins every dip is an opportunity to make an investment. Very few make use of this while majority of the users just keep hold of the assets for the bull trend. To make a good profit out of bitcoin it is a must to move along with the market than just holding focusing on targeted growth.

Perhaps we can capitalize on the current market downturn, but not everyone is knowledgeable about this. When the stock market appears to be in the red, some might think it will continue, waiting for the right time to buy. Without realizing that the market turns green again, and vice versa.

Maybe we realize that taking advantage of the market is much better than waiting for the target of a bull run. However, for those who lack patience, they often experience misfortune, so they prefer long-term investments by investing without checking the changing conditions of crypto prices.

We are not talking about crypto here, since we don't give any shits about shitcoins.

By the way, you did not use the word bitcoin in any place in your post, which may signal that you are actually lost and you posted in the wrong thread.

Now if you mistakenly used the word crypto when you meant to say bitcoin, then that might be understandable, but I don't see why anyone would want to use the word crypto instead of just using the word bitcoin unless: 1) he either does not know what bitcoin is 2) he just wanted to sound smarter to make it seem as if the same principles that apply to bitcoin applies to shitcoins too.. which surely is not true or 3) he is being disingenuine and purposefully trying to distract or mistlead the conversation (which I am not going to presume those kinds of bad intentions without further evidence).

If you had not realized, you cannot apply the same principles to shitcoins as you would for bitcoin, since bitcoin is something that has value and the overwhelming majority (if not all) shitcoins are either affinity scams or something close to that in which they are just coat tailing off of bitcoin's security, and sure no problem that they exist and that they are being used to mislead and scam people. That is the way the world works, correct? Yet, we should at least recognize and appreciate that shitcoins (crypto), is not the same as bitcoin since their performance is nearly completely dependent upon bitcoin's performance.