Quote from: JayJuanGee on Today at 07:56:15 PM

Quote from: ShowOff on Today at 04:06:29 PM

Quote from: Salahmu on Today at 03:52:48 PM

Quote from: Mayor of ogba on Today at 03:00:36 AM

Bitcoin investment is something we should not be in a hurry to start if we don't have a source of income. If you use the available fund to start your bitcoin accumulation journey without any source of income, you will tamper with your bitcoin holdings to survive when the available fund has run out.

In as much as I would agree on what you said but I think with a proper planning someone that doesn't have source of income could actually start accumulating Bitcoin, however he could start by using the little money he has to start up a business and with time and consistent you will see that the business will start yielding a good profit for him to start the Bitcoin journey while his normal business will now serve him as his source of income and before he realized he has already become a Bitcoin holder, however in life most people are always afraid of trying because they are clouded by negative mindset that's why most people will always speculate about the price of Bitcoin to get to a particular level before they could start buying and sometimes they miss out the opportunities because they are always scared of what will become of there investment. So actually with a proper planning there is no limitation to what someone can achieve through Bitcoin investment in the future.

Build a business first, get the profits, then invest in bitcoin?
If that's what you mean, can the business promise profits? I think every business that is built certainly does not guarantee that the entrepreneur will get the profit as expected, that is a risk that really should not be ignored. But your suggestion about how someone can have a source of income is correct, I also agree with it.

Business and investment both have risks, but the risks may be different. Investing in bitcoin is simple if you are only interested in being a holder, it can save more emotions due to uncertain market volatility. A person can invest in bitcoin even if they don't have a steady source of income, but they should at least have a way to save money whenever they have money. Despite their excessive fear of investment risks, they have never been forced to do so. Only people who can consider high risks are worth investing in, if they are afraid of losing, then they should just keep their money under a pillow.

I doubt that any of us can really advise with any level of confidence regarding how anyone might need to direct his resources - because surely building a business could give better income, yet some businesses are more cash intense than others, and there are some circumstances that normies might receive education in some special fields and be able to earn more money than what he would have otherwise had been able to earn.. so there can be sacrifices in either direction in terms of potentially forgoing income while training and building skills and/or building a business, while at the same time, with bitcoin there is a kind of unique opportunity that likely is going to continue to reward those who are able to get into it first, and investing in bitcoin could well end up being a better forum of financial security and/or freedom than building a business or even going to school in order to build job skills - and I am not even suggesting any of these exclusively because sometimes there could be ways to work towards both, but other times, there are some kinds of activities and/or chosen directions that will preclude or make difficult the pursuit of a competing path, such as investing in bitcoin versus investing into building a business.

Quote from: Tmoonz on Today at 05:52:04 PM

it is also advisable not to invest more than your capacity due to fomo,

Frequently FOMO comes when a no coiner, low coiner or fence-sitter spends a lot of time pondering over when to get into bitcoin and how much to get in and in the end they are either under invested or not invested at all, and then when they see the BTC price moving against them, they end up panic getting in at the wrong time and without a strategy - except expecting that whatever time that they got in, then they expect the BTC price to continue to go up, which may or may not end up happening.

So one of the preventative measures for FOMO is to make sure that we are continuously, ongoingly and persistently stacking sats so that we are sufficiently and adequately prepared for UP.

If we accidentally made the mistake of FOMOing in, and then the BTC price moves against us, then probably the solution would be to continue to buy, except sometimes part of the problem is that a FOMO buyer might have invested his whole BTC allowance amount, and maybe it will take several months for him to be able to start to continue to buy... so experiencing a BTC price correction after FOMO buying can surely contribute towards dilemmas and difficulties in terms of how to recover.. especially if the more logical solution might be to put more into the investment, and that might not make a lot of sense if the person had overinvested. .and maybe even exhausted his emergency funds, reserves, float and perhaps even sometimes had entered into debt in order to buy, and then they are even in worse trouble to recover from those kinds of situations that might involve them having had spent beyond their means.

Quote from: Troytech on Today at 06:13:15 PM

Quote from: JayJuanGee on Today at 01:02:32 AM

It is difficult to give more suggestions than what I already have because you seem to be wanting to time your buys in a way to attempt to get as much bang from them as you can, and sure there is nothing wrong with that, up to a point, but you have to still consider that no matter what you do, you are likely going to still have some cash in your reserves and the price goes up or you run out of cash and the price goes down.

It seems that you also have gone through some of the exercises that we discussed, but really best case, worst case and base case scenarios have short, medium and long term components, and they likely are not very relevant for short term since you probably should mostly be focusing on DCA rather than trying to buy the dip and things like that. .It seems that you do not have enough money coming in on a regular basis to be covering all of the scenarios..so you have to just keep building your various stashes that are going to be combined with BTC, emergency funds, reserves and maybe even maintaining some float so you don't cause yourself to go crazy if you make mistakes and you try to push your BTC buys but then run out of money or fail to plan properly..

One of the solid ways that I can suggest is to create a plan for either 3 or 6 months at a time, but hey, I know that you don't want to do that because you are all excited about the ETFs and about the halvenings, so I cannot really blame you for those kinds of inclinations to front-load rather than budgeting for 3 or for 6 months.

Anyhow, if you budget for 6 months, then you add up all the money that you have available for investing (and maybe you already bought bitcoin with that), an then you have your income coming in which is weekly or twice a month or maybe it is more sporadic than that, but still you have some kind of an idea of your budget, so if you have a weekly allowance in which you are able to buy $100 per week, then whenever the week starts, you can try to figure out the best of the dips during the week, and maybe you buy $33.33 worth of bitcoin each time there is a significant dip, and then by the end of the week, you spend whatever is left, if you have any left, and then the next week you have another $100 in your allowance that you are able to spend, so you can try to buy the dips, but maybe you will get too stressed by that, so what is wrong with just picking a day of the week and then just buy every week on that day?

$100 per week would give you $2,600 invested in 6 months.

If you have $2,400 in your savings, and you decide that you want to spend half of it right away, then you end up buying $1,200 right away, and then maybe the other half you use to buy dips (if there are dips), so then maybe you might set your first dip buy $100 at around $38k, and then every $750 that the BTC price drops then you would end up buying another $100, but that would give you only 12 BTC buy orders, and is that enough for you or not? In my thinking you want BTC buy orders to go slightly below where you think is the most that the BTC price is likely to drop, but maybe you consider that there are no way that you could have 12 buy orders fill.. because that would be buying $100 at each of the price points:
1 = $38,000
2 = $37,250
3 = $36,500
4 = $35,750
5 = $35,000
6 = $34,250
7 = $33,500
8 = $32,750
9 = $32,000
10 = $31,250
11 = $30,500
12 = $29,750
No one knows, so you just try to set your buy orders (increments and amounts) the best that you can (based on your budget and based on your view of not wanting to run out of money to buy but being happy if the BTC price goes up rather than down), and you hope that all of your buy orders don't get filled unless the BTC price spikes down, fills all your orders and then goes back up (I know newbies are not as affected by price drops, but still getting yourself into a mentality of a BTC holder is that you should probably be stacking BTC to such an extent that you are always hoping the BTC price goes up rather than down or sideways).

You don't know.. are your orders going to get filled or not? They should feel like insurance that you don't want to have to use, but you have it in case the drop happens. And maybe the longer that you are in bitcoin the longer you maintain these kinds of buying on the dip ladders while at the same time you are DCA buying on a regular basis, perhaps $100 per week or some other amount that is reasonable based on all of your circumstances that you reassess from time to time.

Thanks sir it has really been helpful, I now know where I'm failing at and that is making long term plans, my plans need to be a little bit long term and also the senerio I would create, I had been building up my emergency funds and reserves quite all right, but now I think k i should also budget a little to saving at leat 3-6 months of cash that I would use to DCA, after every six months in addition to my normal weekly regular plan. I can't say it all, but I would do a real reassessment of my plans and senerio and match it up with what you've said and try to bring it to my terms of comfort. Thanks a lot sir, its really been wonderful having you here.

Of course, creating something like a 6 month plan is still not long term, but it may well be set up within a long term plan of investing and building to set an investment foundation that is going to last 4-10 years or longer, and at the same time, having something like a 6 month plan (or budget), gives you a way to take specific actions within that time frame and then to reassess at or near the end of the period.. and then maybe to extend another 6 months in the same way as previously (perhaps a few tweaks), and if you keep investing with those kinds of 6 months plans that are extended each time, then it could be that it takes a few years before you really are in a position to start to consider that maybe you are going to need to change something more major in your plan.. but then you can see what you have done and then if some of your theories about what might happen are coming true or at least which of the various paths are you finding yourself on.. and sure when you create a plan now, when you get T+3 years later, then you might have to look back at your notes to figure out what it was that you were planning because some of what you were planning 3 years earlier might not be relevant because facts (or history) would have gone in a certain direction so that your various hypotheticals ended up following a certain path that is no longer hypothetical, but when it comes to your planning the future from that point, you still would be considering where you are at, how you got there and where you might go (which the where you might go part is still going to likely branch off into a variety of possibilities with some possibilities being more likely than others.

Quote from: Fara Chan on Today at 07:14:49 PM

Quote from: Rustam Meraj on Today at 11:36:24 AM

Bitcoin is an asset which needs your holding powers. If you will hold it and wait. So this will give a big surprise. But making it as a source of income this is not a good decision by the way. First make a passive income source which will feed family and then invest in Bitcoin. Means I want to say that if you will be mentally relaxed so you will invest in Bitcoin and can hold for a long time.
It is my point of view other may disagree. I just share my point of view.

I also quite understand the point of view that you explain because someone whose condition is quite relaxed and does not feel any difficulties in life, of course it will be easier to keep Bitcoin for a long time if that person is very confident and believes in Bitcoin. But I will still consider Bitcoin as a very good source of income even though everyone who believes in Bitcoin must also have other sources of passive income so that they can be more relaxed in holding Bitcoin and will not easily panic about their own living conditions.

I will not blame your point of view in this case because basically everyone has their own point of view in understanding all things, including this one thing. However, Bitcoin must always be considered good and even worthy of being considered as a good source of income so that each owner will continue to maintain their ownership very well without being affected by other things that come unexpectedly.

There are a lot of people who have been able to live off of their bitcoin over the past 5-10 years, but then a question might be whether they have much if any bitcoin left after such a practice of living off of your bitcoin. Personally, I don't have any problem with the idea of living off your bitcoin, once they have reached a sufficiently large enough stash that you are able to start to draw from them... but if you are still in the building phase of your BTC holdings, then you would be working against yourself if you are living off of your bitcoin and building your stash size at the same time.

So the guys who have been drawing from the bitcoin and sucking the income off of their bitcoin every year or two, they likely have not accumulated very many bitcoin, so at what point in your bitcoin journey did you reach a status in which you could start to use your bitcoin as an income source, rather than to build your stash.

If you give me your income goals (such as how much you need per month or per year), then I can look at my entry-level fuck you status chart to figure out how many bitcoin you would have had needed to have in order to sustainably live off of your bitcoin.. another possibility would be to look at my sustainable withdrawal tool^{(powered by bitserver)}, which is quite a bit more customizable in order to figure out how many BTC you might need to achieve a sustainable withdrawal..

Let's go by your forum registration date Fara Chan, and figure out how many coins you might have needed in April 2017 and maybe how many coins that you might have had needed at various points between 2017 and how, and then if you had lump sum invested into bitcoin or maybe if you DCA'd into bitcoin how much would you have to invest in order to get to a point that starting to withdraw or to live off your bitcoin or to draw an income from it would be long-term smart rather than more likely undermining your ability to ever get to a state in which you bitcon would be able to serve as a kind of sustainable income to either fully or to partially fund your chosen lifestyle.

Quote from: Aanuoluwatofunmi on Today at 07:23:39 PM

Quote from: Fara Chan on Today at 07:14:49 PM

Quote from: Rustam Meraj on Today at 11:36:24 AM

Bitcoin is an asset which needs your holding powers. If you will hold it and wait. So this will give a big surprise. But making it as a source of income this is not a good decision by the way. First make a passive income source which will feed family and then invest in Bitcoin. Means I want to say that if you will be mentally relaxed so you will invest in Bitcoin and can hold for a long time.
It is my point of view other may disagree. I just share my point of view.

I also quite understand the point of view that you explain because someone whose condition is quite relaxed and does not feel any difficulties in life, of course it will be easier to keep Bitcoin for a long time if that person is very confident and believes in Bitcoin. But I will still consider Bitcoin as a very good source of income even though everyone who believes in Bitcoin must also have other sources of passive income so that they can be more relaxed in holding Bitcoin and will not easily panic about their own living conditions.

I will not blame your point of view in this case because basically everyone has their own point of view in understanding all things, including this one thing. However, Bitcoin must always be considered good and even worthy of being considered as a good source of income so that each owner will continue to maintain their ownership very well without being affected by other things that come unexpectedly.

We should however always remember that we are going to only be ready of affording to make an investment on what we are capable of, this is not what should be done in haste or without having adequate and proper plan, we have to set a budget for how we want to go about with the kind of investment we are opting in for, take and manage the risk involved and have the understanding of the necessary requirements needed for it to turns a profitable one on us.

You are not wrong Aanuoluwatofunmi; however, you can also adjust your level of investment aggressiveness with the passage of time and as you get used to investing into bitcoin, in the event that you might consider that you might be in a better position to invest more aggressively. And, surely you can go the other direction too... Some people might come to bitcoin and start out overly aggressive, but then realize that they need to temper their investment amount so that they do not put themselves into a bad situation.. and some of that can come from practice and also really going through and assessing your situation, and some folks might not realize that their emergency fund, reserves and/or float is inadequate, so then they might come to realize that they need to build that portion of their overall investment portfolio so that their BTC will be safer if the BTC price runs against them or if some kind of an emergency comes and they might not want to spend from their bitcoin, but if their emergency fund, reserves and float is high enough, then they would be able to have more choices in regards to where they are going to draw value when they might need funds (liquidity).

Empiricism is a doctrinal believe that knowledge comes from experience, it emphasizes the importance of experience and sense perception as the source and basis of knowledge.

What I have gotten Which is most important is to get
Started and learn even more in the process.thanks sir I really appreciate.