Quote from: JayJuanGee on May 06, 2024, 02:56:35 PM

Quote from: Frankolala on May 06, 2024, 07:11:53 AM

Quote from: JayJuanGee on May 05, 2024, 11:30:10 PM

Surely there is nothing wrong with buying on dips, but a person who has a tight budget might not really be in a situation to change the amount of his weekly-ish investment into bitcoin, so he might well be buying at any price until he works up a bitcoin holding that he believes is enough or more than enough.

I agree with you on this, because some investors can only afford a particular amount as their discretionary income which that is the amount that they can only continue using to purchase bitcoin regularly, and when there is a dip, they only wish that they had more to buy at the dip, but nothing changes as their regular DCA is ongoing.

DCA is good, but if one is in the position of mixing it with buying at the dip, he will achieve a better result compare to doing strictly DCA, but it is not everyone that is at the position to do so, and that is why one needs to look for a means in order to increase his income so that he can be capable of taking advantage of the dip when it comes. People that have jobs, and don't have a means of increasing their income can save some extra funds that comes in that is not part of their salary, funds like bonus or traveling allowance and so on. This will help to buy extra during the dip.

Even if a newbie increases his income, the problem of buying right away (in a DCA) versus holding some value in reserves for buying on dips is not automatically resolved merely because of such increased income, and it seems that the problem of having money to buy dips is more likely to be resolved by feeling like you have already been accumulating enough BTC and you are able to hold some extra money in reserves for buying on dips....

Another practice that would justify holding back money for buying on the dip would be if you might have already invested a large amount at any given price point (such as using a lump sum), and then therefore you might hold some money in reserves in order to buy the dip, but since you had already invested a decent amount, it is not like you are prejudiced by holding some value back for buying on the dip.

Part of the definition of discretionary income is having discretion regarding where to put that money as it comes in and if the discretionary income amount is increasing by either receiving greater income or cutting expenses, then there still will be decisions in regards to where to put such increased discretionary income amounts of money as it comes in and whether to keep some in reserves for buying BTC on dips or to just buy BTC in a way that is more or less as soon as the extra money comes available which would be considered to be within DCA practices.

I am not going to proclaim to know the answers to these questions because if someone does increase his discretionary income, he still is faced with needs to have to decide whether to buy BTC right away with that increased income or to hold some of that extra income back for buying on dips - not necessarily easy or obvious choices.. yet each of us are making these kinds of balances on a regular basis involving how much BTC we believe that we are ready, willing and able to accumulate and in which ways we are going to carry out such BTC accumulations as our income/expenses might change from time to time, the size of our investment into BTC would presumably be growing with the passage of time, but also the value of our BTC holdings will also be changing (including the price in which we are able to buy more of it, if that is what we want to do).

Quote from: Hamza2424 on May 06, 2024, 08:05:04 AM

Quote from: JayJuanGee on May 05, 2024, 11:30:10 PM

That sounds like a trader speaking, and we should not presume that people who buy bitcoin are traders.

There are a lot of us why specifically recommend not to trade bitcoin, but instead to long term invest it, so in that sense, you do not have to focus much on selling it or when you sell it, until after you have accumulated enough and perhaps been in it for a long enough time.. so then the decisions about when and how to sell could well come later, even 10, 20 or 30 years after being in it...

Yet, of course, it would be difficult to suggest that anyone buying bitcoin for 10, 20 or 30 years not think about selling at all, since the selling kinds of considerations would likely have to do with the person's situation in terms of how aggressively or whimpily he might have been accumulating BTC in light of his own financial and/or psychological circumstances.

Hmm, JJG I was expecting haha if you are active I'll get this reply, anyway, it has been a long time since you've made a quote on my post, cutting the story to a focus point, yup my response was from a trader's perspective as I do acknowledge that 70% of newbies and investors enter as a short term trader they don't care about the Bitcoin's potential and returns in even a time frame of 5 years to 10 years. We can roughly find 5 out of 100 people who are serious about the long-term accumulation as you are saying, for the rest of 95 they are just trying their luck without even realizing the facts and figures.

I doubt that your numbers for traders versus investors are correct with any level of precision (in other words you are making up numbers to make your claims sound good, even if your numbers might have some truth to them), yet even if we agree that a lot of people treat bitcoin as a trade rather than as an investment, I doubt that it is a good idea to promote such dumbness as if it is a good thing to do, especially since many of us already recognize and appreciate that bitcoin remains amongst the best, if not the best investment available to anyone on a world-wide basis, so if you happen to know that kind of information, then why would it be a good idea to encourage trading it (or gambling with it, rather than more sound practices), merely because potentially a lot of folks are doing that. Pretty weak logic there Hamza2424.

Another thing, there may well be a lot of people who have little to no disposable income (and I agree that is the case), so those people who are using their money to buy bitcoin (when it is beyond their disposable income - because they need such money to live) are therefore gambling with their money rather than investing, and surely there could be ways that they could figure out ways to reduce the amount that they put into bitcoin in order to be able to hang onto it longer which would turn their buying of bitcoin into an investment rather than a trade.. rather than attempting to play the wave that is likely not going to get them anywhere in life.. .. It is like playing the lottery. Yes, I know a lot of people do it, but it is not a good place to put your money, so it does not make any sense to be promoting such systems - especially on an individual level, even though people seem to love to do it.

When they put the money that they need into bitcoin and hope to cash out with dollar profits within a cycle, they may well be attempting to play 1-2 years.. and yeah, maybe they will get lucky with that approach and maybe they won't.. and yeah.. maybe if there already exist ways that they are able to set aside that money for 1-2 years, then there would be possibilities for them to choose a different amount (perhaps a smaller amount), in order to set it aside longer, such as 4-10 years or longer, and 4 years is surely on the lower end that would ONLY apply to people with short timelines, and most people should be shooting for way longer than 4 years, otherwise they are still not really investing.

If they were to figure out what it means to invest, then they may be able to figure out how to do such a thing for 4-10 years or longer rather than 1-2 years or some other short timeline trying to play the wave.. ... but yeah it well still it probably would be better if they figured out an amount that they are able to put away for longer than 1-2 years and not worry about it for 4-10 years or longer. There may well be some mindset involved in this rather than any kind of specific inabilities to develop better practices (even though yeah a lot of the world is desperate, yet they likely are not going to improve their situation by trading and gambling with bitcoin rather than figuring out some way to carry out investments, even if their investment amounts happen to not be a lot of money.. but still setting it aside for 4-10 years or longer.

And personally, you can do what you want, but I am not going to encourage trading/gambling rather than investing in bitcoin - even if perhaps a lot of people engage in such bad habits, as you proclaim.

So yeah, just because a lot of people trade and/or gamble with bitcoin and you seem to want to promote those ideas, that does not mean that it is good to promote such ideas as if they were the right thing to do.. You can do what you like, and I will continue to say that it is a bad idea to talk about bitcoin that way, even if a lot of people do it.

And this line of discussion reminds me of an earlier conversation that we had. Weren't you the one who was trying to defend the idea to refer to bitcoin as crypto because a lot of people (everyone else) do(es) it? That is dumb logic, and surely I could be getting you mixed up with someone else, but it seems that we had that kind of conversation in the past in which you were also using vague language such as crypto to also include bitcoin and suggesting that it is a good idea talk about bitcoin like that because everyone else does it..

Poor you to have such lackenings in your abilities to focus.. and you are getting caught up in the fault of logic that involves what everyone else is doing to guide you in your own thinking and/or actions, again presuming that I am not mixing you up with another forum member.

Quote from: Hamza2424 on May 06, 2024, 08:05:04 AM

Quote from: JayJuanGee on May 05, 2024, 11:30:10 PM

I have not yet seen anything about 47k BTC being accumulated, but yeah, surely in these times, it is may well be easier to NOT to be surprised various kinds of ongoing buying pressures.

Well I can add the reference but I know it's not worth it, any still here the references I've not gone through the entire blog just scanned it with the headline “Bitcoin whales accumulated 47,000 $BTC in the past 24 hours. We’re entering a new era.”

It is good to provide sources for those kinds of assertions, and like you said, it might not be an accurate assessment, but at least if you show the source, then any of us would be able to look into it further.

Quote from: SmartGold01 on May 06, 2024, 10:37:34 AM

This is the main reason they said market is volatile and anything can happen at any given point but how do you control it as an investors or trader, is to have it parted after securing your profit for the maintime. What i mean is that if you buy a coin worth of 300$ and immediately in pump to 500$ first you sell your of 300$ and take profits leaving your 200$ gambling with. Then if you just buy and market declining what to do is don't panic keep accumulating more and more then you would see that when the market bounces back then you have double of what you had invested earlier.

You will likely do much better if you have some kind of a long term plan in regards to bitcoin, and sure if you cannot resist but to gamble and/or trade with you bitcoin, make sure that you are not gambling/trading with more than 10% of your bitcoin - while at the same time, don't be cheating by continuing to dip into your main stash of bitcoin when you are losing the 10% that you are fucking around with. There are ways to discipline yourself with limits but also to potentially still gamble/trade within such limits.

Try and try until you do find out on whats the best thing for you and as much as possible then the more the better but of course it would really be needing that proper time management and handling so that you could really be able to do such thing because if not then you would really be finding up yourself on being challenged because dealing up with multiple things wont really be that easy.It isnt really just that you would really be needing that time handling but also you would really be needing that financial management too, considering that you are dealing with multiple things which could really be bringing up that potential income and could really be put up into your condition that you could have multiple income streams but of course it wont really be that a guaranteed thing considering that both does involved out some risks but somewhat it is really just that worth on dealing up with this because how you would really be able to make yourself that be successful if you wont really be making out such move?

Some people doesnt really like on involving themselves too much in so much risks specially on trading which we know that not all would really be that capable on doing so and dealing with the market
with so much volatility isnt something that wont really be that simple but doesnt mean that its impossible to deal with.it is really just that it does really require sufficient knowledge
and skills for you to be able to handle up yourself onto this market but of course it would really be needing that sufficient effort and risks taking.