Quote from: arwin100 on Today at 11:45:13 AM

Quote from: JayJuanGee on July 27, 2024, 05:26:58 PM

Quote from: Odohu on July 27, 2024, 02:57:22 PM

Quote from: JayJuanGee on July 27, 2024, 07:31:23 AM

Quote from: Odohu on July 26, 2024, 09:39:15 PM

Quote from: GeorgeJohn on July 26, 2024, 06:25:59 PM

the is that is good to have a mentor in anything that has to cryptocurrency both trading and investment, and that mentor should be someone you know and can access at any point in time, so I believe that we have to understand that investment is quite different from trading because you may not bother to learn and master ways of buying and selling of cryptocurrency kind of investment and you may have or experience a profit, but in trading you have to acquire the knowledge before you can excel in trading, and trading need for you to have a mentor that's well known.

When I was still pursuing a career in trading, even mentors will send a disclaimer that they are only giving you information with no guarantee that the information will work, and that the bulk of the job is in you finding what works for you. Some that are honest will tell you that until you personalise the information they are sharing, then you cannot make good use of them. This then mean that mentorship is good for many things but for trading, even your mentor will be struggling to make profits but will use paper trading for examples and will never want to trade live market with you because he understands its a different thing all together.

Like I said before, demo trading is easy and everyone is usually a champion is demo which is in hindsight but when it comes to trading live market, even the mentors will hide for the sake of their reputation because Bitcoin will always mess them up when they try to predict the price movement with certainty.

I have tried many things when it concern trading including using different mentors. When the chips are down, you will realise it is only you and the market.

Trading is just too subjective and this is the reason it is difficult to scale through and the reason I choose another route which in buying and holding for long term.

I agree with everything in your post Odohu, which largely it is difficult to find your right balance when it comes to trading, and so whether you end up trading and/or investing, you need to figure out your right balance, so in that regard, I believe that using your actual money is better than demo trading.. so any of us should be able to figure out some kind of balance in terms of how much we trade or how much we invest in which we are not nervous about whether we win or lose, so in that regard, if you are nervous about it, then you are likely trading/investing too much.

You have given a good summary to this discussion which comes back to personalizing the knowledge and information to be able to work out a system that works for the individual, this being married to our financial status, risk appetite and targets.

Quote from: JayJuanGee on July 27, 2024, 07:31:23 AM

In other words, I would suggest to practice with real money rather than fake money, even if your budget might start with just $100.. and so there is likely some need to have real money at stake in order to really learn, but you do not need to use a lot of money to learn, but it should be an amount that you are willing to learn, whether you consider yourself to be merely practicing or investing for the long term with real desires to make money and/or to increase your future options in life.

I will try trading again sometime in the future when I would have established the kind of portfolio I want in Bitcoin. The suspension is just to avoid any distraction and to enable me properly manage my finances. I know that it could be a wonderful opportunity to make good morning within a reduced interval of time but I have seen that it is not easy to become a consistent and profitable trader, the reason I am taking my time too.

Furthermore, I have noticed that trading is more of a psychological game which will become problematic if there is any form of desperation to make profits. In other words, as soon as one is fixed on making money quickly, then the fear of losing will creep in and this will do more damage than good. I don't want to trade with funds I'm afraid of losing, so I'm working out a method to enable me achieve this.

Surely many of us understand and appreciate that trading takes more particular kinds of skills that can take quite a long time to build up so that you do not lose money and also that you might be able to make more money through trading than by merely holding. So since many of us realize that bitcoin is such a great asset to hold, it hardly makes any sense to try to trade it.

So, frequently I suggest to build up your bitcoin holdings to a certain comfortable size, and then if after you have achieved such comfortable size, then maybe you could figure out some kind of systems to have a smaller budget (such as a budget that is less than 10% of your bitcoin holdings, or maybe some other reasonable level of practice budget) to trade or to practice trading... but yeah if you do not set reasonable limits on yourself and also make sure that you are investing a sufficient amount, there could be some slippery slope dynamics with your trading that devolves too much into gambling rather than trading.. .. so in that regard there are some guys that figure out profitable trading systems.. they are likely quite rare, yet we cannot necessarily stop folks from exploring their interests and their curiosities.

But what I think the people could able to handle this are those who have deep pocket and so eager to learn those technicalities whatever it takes or scenarios they are facing on.

Your point seems misleading to me. I doubt that you need deep pockets in order to learn to trade or to become good at it and/or profitable.

More than anything, you do likely need time and probably a bit of smartness to figure out how to use various trading tools to your advantage, including that you might well end up using various shitcoins as some of your trading tools.

Traders might be smarter than investors in various ways, but the mere fact that you are smart does not mean that you will make money, and it could take quite a bit of time to create and implement various systems that end up long term causing the trading to be more profitable than a more strict accumulation/investment approach to bitcoin... especially long term.. since there can even be quite a few years of streaks of profitability, yet push comes to shove to be able to get through a cycle or two and still be able to compare that trading ended up being more profitable than what might have had been a more straight-forward and strict accumulation/investment approach to BTC.

Quote from: arwin100 on Today at 11:45:13 AM

And I believe that not everyone could able to handle that, since usually people who came into trading are just been hype on the idea that there's quick profit for buying low and sell when price goes up on their favorite coins they are trading, but realize that everything is not easy and they get a lot of stress and pressure for following each movements also trends since if they don't do that they will just lose their money for taking bad actions on what they are doing.

I agree with all of this, and surely the folks with lower levels of capital might also be trading beyond their capital, so they likely get impatient and devolve into gambling rather than trading, so it likely takes a lot of discipline to build up a investment portfolio (including building up the BTC portion of that) when starting with lower levels of capital, and I am not even proclaiming that trading is a good way to use time, since getting an income sources and building capital can be good things for beginners to do prior to trading, yet it is up to each person to figure out how they want to use their time and to attempt to determine if they can generate more cashflow by trading as compared with having some other sources of income so that they can pay for their living expenses through their non-trading sources of income.. so yeah, people do all kinds of dumb shit to suggest that they are living off of their trading, and so both generating an income to pay for living expenses through trading and at the same time building an investment portfolio can be quite difficult to accomplish... and frequently traders deceive themselves in terms of the sustainability or even the preferability of their own trading, income generating and/or investing practices.. Sometimes when they are in the midst of all of it, they might not even be able to recognize and/or appreciate their own practices as compared to what maybe would be better and/or best practices.. .. and surely there is likely not even one exact best practice, since any practice, whether trading and/or investing has to likely be tailorized to the persons personal circumstances including the 9 individual investing factors .. which might slightly differ for a trader as compared with an investor, but a lot of the same factors are going to overlap and still need to be considered for a trader.

Quote from: arwin100 on Today at 11:45:13 AM

That's why its really good that bitcoin holding option is present and there's a working strategy which people could use to make everything in good place then engage with less stressful activities since the only thing they need is to be consistent on their accumulation and follow the strategy they are working on. There are times before which I think gambling and trading is the same for instances that sometimes we win and there are times we lose our money for that activity.

I think that the main dichotomy is investing versus trading, and so trading can devolve into gambling, and so on the spectrum trading should be considered to be way closer to gambling than investing, and surely there are folks who don't know how to sufficiently differentiate between investing, trading and gambling, and so they might consider them all to be close to the same thing..so then their thinking may well be overly garbled and lacking in specifics, and surely they might not be completely wrong in their assessment that all of the areas are related (or can be related) on a theoretical level, yet when they are not able to sufficiently and/or adequately differentiate between investing, trading and gambling, then their thinking on the topic might contribute to their own making way more mistakes than they otherwise would have had made if they were to actually be able to identify and structure their own approach and practices according to such differences and they also may well end up employing sloppy and risky strategies and practices because they have not sufficiently/adequately figured out ways to differentiate between the concepts and to figure out ways to plan and implement their own strategies to account for such differences.