Quote from: TwitchySeal on October 09, 2024, 02:18:14 AM

You're not going to like to hear this, but communism is not about "equal outcomes". It's about equal distribution or access/availability of goods and services through a market and economy fully controlled by the state.

Why wouldn't I like to hear that? You don't explain anything new to me, I know as much or more about communist theory as you do or more.

Quote from: TwitchySeal on October 09, 2024, 02:18:14 AM

In a communist society, people don't own property.

False. To know so much about communist theory you don't understand the basics, what you don't have in communist societies is ownership of the means of production, but people had private possessions like cars, clothes and houses.

Soviet law in Principles and policies

What It Was Like To Buy And Own A Car In The USSR

What items of status did Soviet people own? (PHOTOS)

Then there are societies such as North Korea that restrict property more, and others that restrict it less, but in all of them there is private property, otherwise it would not make sense to have a currency circulating to buy goods and services.

If you start with such falsehood, and above all getting merits for it, lol, it is going to be very difficult to debate.

Are you going to admit that what you have said is false or what?

Quote from: TwitchySeal on October 09, 2024, 02:18:14 AM

It's ironic, but Marx would agree with a lot of the arguments being made by right wingers who include 'communism' and 'equality of outcomes' in their rhetoric (except for what communism is implied to be):

Yes, I've heard that nonsense based on a very selective cherry pick many times. I'm sure Marx advocated that the best thing the state can do to improve the lives of individuals is to allow them freedom, mainly with few regulations, few taxes, and respecting freedom of enterprise.

Quote from: TwitchySeal on October 09, 2024, 02:18:14 AM

When Kamala starts suggesting ideas that are distinct to communism, like that we'd be better off without free markets, or getting rid of the concept of private property, then it would make sense to call her a communist.

Here the question is that the regimes that ended communist dictatorships, especially after the fall of the Berlin Wall, have initially tried to dissociate themselves from communism when they are just another variant. Look at what Hispo says, who lives in Venezuela, and who knows first hand what happened there, when it all started with Chavez saying he was “socialist” when in reality he was just another communist.

So now she says nothing about free markets but is in favor of an increasing interventionism and as for private property, just look at how she talks about “children of the community” and you can get an idea of the respect she has for the property and freedom of individuals and their families.

Quote from: suchmoon on October 09, 2024, 08:11:23 PM

Thank you, but (1) I don't think I'm "lefty", you seem to be over-extrapolating too much from me not supporting a grifter who happens to be a Republican; and (2) none of what you're complaining about is communism.

If you are not lefty I am not right-wing because I believe that the US health care system is garbage and should be changed to one where everyone is cared for without being bankrupt, because I believe that the gambling sector has to be strongly regulated and monitored by the state, and because on moral issues such as abortion, gay marriage and others I tend to converge with leftist positions, although I do not buy into feminazism. If what you mean is that you are a free thinker who happens not to converge with a lot of what Trump says, the same thing happens to me but with Kamala.

Quote from: suchmoon on October 09, 2024, 08:11:23 PM

Throwing "communism" around like this defeats whatever point you might be trying to make. Any sane person looks at this and looks at North Korea and knows this is a bullshit argument.

Any sane person who looks not only at North Korea but also at what happened in Venezuela, for example, realizes that the only way to implement communism is not overnight. It can also be implemented little by little, step by step, saying that you are not a communist but that it is unfair that the rich earn so much and that the best thing is for the state to take away what they earn so that we are all equal, and the story ends with everyone being equally poor, those who survive.

Kamala is not going to implement a communism overnight, she is going to go little by little. What's more, the latest from the Democratic party is wanting to abolish the first amendment. Have you heard Kerry and Walz talk about it? A project that seems to have been dreamed up by a high ranking Stalinist. Ban what can't be said from a state body, controlled by the Democrats, of course.