Quote from: Mayor of ogba on Today at 07:25:40 AM

Quote from: ZeroVinsonN on March 26, 2025, 10:07:26 AM

Quote from: Ricardo11 on March 26, 2025, 07:00:23 AM

In my opinion, an investor who knows the essentials and is well-versed in Bitcoin will never decide to invest an amount of money that he cannot afford to lose.

Using the term money that he cannot afford to lose makes it sound alot like gambling and not investing because gamblers are the ones usually adviced to gamble responsibly and with money they can afford to lose. An investor should never have this mindset

Just because you were advised in the gambling section of the forum to always use the money you can afford to lose when gambling doesn't imply that if you are also using the money you can afford to lose when investing in bitcoin for the long term, you are gambling with your bitcoin investment.

Even though we know that their are aspects of the mindset and approach that differs between investors and traders, the concept of investing (or putting in) no more than you can afford to lose applies to both, so I am not sure why guys keep getting caught up upon the idea of not putting in more than you can lose as if it were a gambling/trading mentality, when it also applies to investing...especially in something as volatile as bitcoin.

Quote from: Mayor of ogba on Today at 07:25:40 AM

Since bitcoin is a long-term investment, it is suitable for someone who wants to invest in bitcoin for the long term to always use the money he or she can comfortably afford to lose when investing in bitcoin so that he or she will always have 100% control over his or her bitcoin and have enough money left that will take care of his or her daily expenses and be in the perfect state of mind to hold his or her bitcoin portfolio for the long term, so don't be deceived that when someone is using the money he or she can afford to lose to invest in bitcoin, he or she is gambling with his or her bitcoin investment because that is the right way to go about bitcoin investment.

Even traders will speculate that they will be better off to try to put their bitcoin to work by selling high and then rebuying BTC back lower, and so they consider that they are going to be able to build their BTC holdings faster and greater by trading rather than just focusing on buying... so surely they may well have a lot of similar goals to investors so long as they are trying to stack more bitcoin rather than stacking dollars, yet they still run into an ongoing and ever-present problem of sometimes selling too much too soon or alternatively spending a lot of time waiting rather than proactively buying BTC.

It will be rare for traders to outperform investors in a time period of a couple of cycles, yet they still are going to be advantaged when the limit their investment within their discretionary income and they are using money that is not needed for expenses and money that they could afford to lose, in the even that their trades go bad (not that any trader wants to lose, just as no investor wants to lose either, even though the investor is not tending to use any kind of selling techniques as part of his way to accumulate bitcoin).

Quote from: ZeroVinsonN on Today at 03:02:20 PM

Quote from: Ruttoshi on Today at 01:19:59 PM

Quote from: ZeroVinsonN on Today at 06:11:37 AM

Quote from: Onyeeze on March 28, 2025, 10:04:38 PM

Quote from: len01 on March 28, 2025, 09:39:37 PM

Quote from: JayJuanGee on March 28, 2025, 04:57:29 PM

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from the way I am seeing Bitcoin there is no time bitcoin will reduce to a point that people will rush and purchase Bitcoin, because people like to invest on Bitcoin when the price is high and they do expect that immediately the invest on bitcoin when the price is high they will also profit immediately, that has been the problem of people,

The whole point of buying the dip and holding is because the price of bitcoin has decreased, saying people like to invest in bitcoin when the price is high is confusing to me, sure using the DCA means that you buy bitcoin regardless of the price at the time, this doesn't mean they like buying when the price is high, and also to buy when the price is high to make profit immediately just sounds crazy coz who does that??? Maybe they are people with such complex out there, I don't know about them though, people who buy during a price shift are more likely to buy during a dip, not when the price is high, even the traders mindset of making quick profit is only even possible if they buy low and sell high.

Of course, there are peopleout there that buy bitcoin when the price is increasing due to FOMO. A lot of people buying bitcoin currently had the opportunity to buy bitcoin when the price was at 10k but they overlooked at bitcoin and didn't bother. Now that they're started buying after bitcoin reached 100k.

Some people also thought that bitcoin price is only going up during the bull market and they bought at 100k believing that bitcoin will reach 150k so that let them sell and take profits but they're regretting now and some have sold at loss after they see bitcoin price correction.

The focus should be long-term investment mindset and plan accordingly, so that you can reach your bitcoin target or close to your target in future through your regular, consistent and persistent buying to keep your bitcoin accumulation ongoing and if possible aggressively.

Yes, but people who bought at 100k instead of 10k wish they had bought at 10k and they bought at 100k because they believe the price will go higher, this doesn't mean that people like to buy when the price is high, they are simply buying now because they have seen how far bitcoin has come and they trust it will go even higher.
Invest in bitcoin using the DCA, if you happen upon extra cash when a DIP happens, buy the DIP and when the dip is over, continue with the DCA, you shouldn't have to wait for a dip to buy or wait for a price hike to buy as was seemingly stated in the initial post I quoted, a change in price should be used to an investor's advantage but it should not be your primary reason for investing.

There is a certain amount of correctness in your explanation ZeroVinsonN, and surely there can be people who knew about bitcoin when it was much lower prices, such as when it was below $10k through much of the time prior to 2021, and for some reason they were not motivated to either research into bitcoin or to start some kind of a BTC buying plan, and so through further BTC price actions and news around BTC, they may have come to realize (perhaps even when the BTC price crossed $100k) that bitcoin remains a good place to put their value, they are not able to turn back the clock, so they have to decide what to do based on their current position rather than wishing the BTC price would go back down to $10k, $20k, $30k, $40k, $50k or some of those other fantasy prices that are not likely to happen.

Sure, right now we see that there are greater odds that BTC prices could dip into the $70ks or even into the $60ks, yet there is no guarantee of that either, just as there was no guarantee that bitcoin was not going to continue to go up after reaching $100k rather than correcting back down. Each of us has to decide what to do from where we are at rather than wishing to turn back the clock or even having expectations that the BTC price is going to dip, when there is no way to know if it is going to continue to dip or not, and the best that no coiners and low coiners can do is to start to buy BTC and to not get overly concerned about price, since no matter what they do, it is going to take a while to build their bitcoin portfolio, and it is likely better that they figure out ways to consistently and persistently buy bitcoin rather than engaging in further waiting patterns, which might have had been part of their past mistake if they had failed/refused to act upon their having had heard about bitcoin prior to 2021.

No matter the money we have coming in, we can decide if we are going to invest large portions of our discretionary income into bitcoin at whatever are the current prices or if we are going to hold any of that money back for buying dips, and surely we might have some decently good ideas about our regular income and our regular expenses, yet at the same time, there may be some times in which we are able to generate higher income or receive extra funds that we can consider if we are going to put that extra money into bitcoin right away at the current price or to hold some of it back for buying dips or spreading it out in a DCAing kind of a way of deferring our buying of bitcoin.

There is no exactly correct answer to the question, and guys have to figure out their own balancing of their aggressiveness in accumulating bitcoin within the confines of considering their own individual factors.

Quote from: harapan on Today at 03:11:21 PM

Quote from: klaaas on April 17, 2019, 01:16:37 PM

Start buying at timed intervals, On the long run you increase your stack and got less worries about the price. It will give ease of mind to not check the charts every x minutes ; )

Honestly it's not as easy as it may seems to buy the dip because one is afraid of having losses but I think it's preferable to buy the dip when it's close to a pump but regardless i go on with the mindset of always checking the charts every now and then, inorder to make sure that you ain't missing out on when you can be profitable.its just that I'm okay with this cause I'm doing this for long-term.

I am not really opposed to the idea of playing around and attempting to find BTC price dips within certain periods of time, so long at guys are not letting a lot of dollars stack up because they are waiting for dips, rather than just buying regularly.

If you are investing for a long time, perhaps 10 years or longer, then why would it matter if you are able to luckily time some kind of maximum dip with your weekly (or perhaps your bi-weekly) buys rather than just buying at whatever the BTC price might be and some of those times might be dips and other times might not be dips. In fact, with regular and persistent buys, some of the times that the BTC buys happen might end up being the opposite of dips, but why would it matter very much in the whole scheme of things, when likely the more important thing is regularly buying and not waiting around too much for dips that may or may not end up happening?

I am not suggesting that there is any preference for anyone to buy when BTC prices are higher, but there are difficulties figuring out dips that may or may not happen, and our ability to identify dips may well be mostly a product of luck rather than anything that we can get realistic feels for when or how much.

If a person has $100 per week and decides to invest $75 every week no matter what, and hold back $25 for possible dips, I don't see any real harm in those kinds of strategies, yet if guys are holding back more than 25% of their authorized BTC purchasing money, they may well be getting distracted from their own goals that should be ongoingly making sure that they are sufficiently/adequately prepared for up.

Guys likely differ in their assessments about how much of their new money coming in to allocate in their preparing for up rather than preparing for down, and surely I would consider that low coiners should be wanting to allocate more of their new money coming if towards their preparations for up rather than their preparations for down, yet surely that is up to them.. and yeah, we we get into trading ideas if guys engage in practices in which they are wanting to use money that is already allocated into bitcoin in order to prepare for further down (that may or may not happen)..so they will start to believe that down is more likely than up and so they will end up even selling portions (if not all) of their already accumulated BTC to prepare for down rather than keeping it in a status that is prepared for up (by staying in BTC). A lot of guys have screwed up their bitcoin holdings by engaging in these kinds of shifts in their focus rather than staying mostly allocated and focused in making sure they stay sufficiently/adequately prepared for up.

Quote from: harapan on Today at 03:21:31 PM

Quote from: malevolent on April 17, 2019, 04:18:43 PM

Quote from: DeathAngel on April 17, 2019, 04:05:56 PM

I’m constantly buying when I’m able to. In a few years the current price will seem like a joke. Anybody who isn’t buying now will majorly regret it.

A lot of people were saying the same thing when the price was in the $10-20k range, and look where the price is now. There's no telling how long this bear market (we're still in one) is going to last; just as a reminder, the previous one lasted for two and a half years.

You're right there's no time anymore cause in no time we should be heading towards a bearish and bullish seasons that might be favourable to the long-term investors.

You don't seem to know what you are talking about. We have been in a bull market since November 2022, and yeah we might not have had been sure about our having had been in a bull market until mid-to-late 2023, but still markets do not just flip flop between bear and bull and we are not in two at the same time, even though sometimes we might not be clear about which one we are in, since being able to assess that we switched remains a bit of a lagging indicator.

Sure, if you are referring to having a lot of volatility, then the volatility can go in either direction, and we can have periods of apparent consolidation that flip into volatility and then flip back into consolidation, yet even those shorter term transitions can be difficult to identify either the break out or the direction of the breakout.

Quote from: harapan on Today at 03:21:31 PM

But irrespective of that I think some people are quite scared to do so, cause of the price fluctuations and they don't want to be in losses after the buy buy buy. I also felt same way but nevertheless I know in no time the outcome will be tremendous profits so I don't want to regrets, that's why I'm buy the little I can and accumulate.

If you have been registered here since mid 2017, you are getting close to 8 years in bitcoin, so hopefully, you have figured out that it is better to keep accumulating bitcoin, yet from your posts, I question the extent to which you have learned those kinds of lessons about how to go about bitcoin accumulation and not to be overly occupied with BTC price swings.

Of course, even if you had a relatively tight budget of $30 per week, if you had been investing $30 per week into bitcoin since the begining of your forum registration, by now you would have invested a bit more than $12k into bitcoin and you would have had accumulated about 1 bitcoin. Not a bad place to be on such a budget level.

Quote from: Mayor of ogba on Today at 03:28:27 PM

Quote from: Barikui1 on March 26, 2025, 07:23:03 AM

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It is very true that nobody is investing in bitcoin with any strategy with the intention to lose his or her hard earned money through bitcoin investment, but when someone says you should use the money you can afford to lose when you are investing in bitcoin, it doesn't mean you will lose you money in bitcoin investment, but it is just a waking-up call or a reminder for you not to use the money that is dedicated to solving your living expenses to invest in bitcoin so that you won't find yourself in a situation where you will be struggling or fail to solve your living expenses, and then you will run to sell part of your bitcoin portfolio to sort yourself out. Investing in bitcoin with the money you can afford to lose and investing in bitcoin with the money you can do away with for a very long time are different terms that mean the same thing, and you can comfortably sort out your living expenses without depending on the money invested into bitcoin if you either use the money you can afford to lose or if you use the money you can do away with for a very long time to invest in bitcoin.

Those are similar concepts, but they are not the same thing.

Sure, you are correct Mayor of ogba about our needs to make sure that our living expenses are covered, and surely our initial investment into bitcoin is based on such considerations that we are not spending beyond the capacity of our discretionary income.

We presume that as our bitcoin investment goes on, especially after investing 4 years or more, then we have greater and greater odds that our investment is going to be in profits and we are going to have more options to be able to draw into that money at some point down the road, and surely there is some truth that if our bitcoin investment ends up being in profits then we have more and more options and also we develop more and more confidence that our investment is going at least as good as expected and perhaps even better than expected.

Yet, the fulfilling of our expectations is not guaranteed, and even though we can choose to cash out parts of our bitcoin investment at various points along the way, we still have the choice to reassess whether the money that we have in bitcoin continues to be money that we are willing to lose or not.. or that we are willing to let it continue to ride.. and surely it becomes easier if the money is in profits, but the dilemma never completely goes away... even though it seems that the most applicable time for the consideration of our willingness to lose the money is when we first allocate that money into bitcoin by buying.

We can have both concepts floating in our head at the same time, and sure we likely have presumptions about bitcoin having a likely long term upward price trajectory, yet we also know that bitcoin's long term upward price trajectory is never guaranteed and remains a probability that we consider to be high enough that we stay invested in bitcoin at the allocation level that we continue to choose to keep.

We might be engaged in an argument about semantics if we want to say that "money we can afford to lose" and "money we can do away with for a long time" mean the same thing or mean different things, yet just from reading the words, I see more of an expectation that the investment is guaranteed in the second statement as compared with the first statement, even though practically we likely are thinking both of the variations of similar ideas when we first get into bitcoin and as we continue to maintain our bitcoin investment.

Quote from: CageMabok on Today at 03:36:20 PM

Quote from: harapan on Today at 03:11:21 PM

Quote from: klaaas on April 17, 2019, 01:16:37 PM

Start buying at timed intervals, On the long run you increase your stack and got less worries about the price. It will give ease of mind to not check the charts every x minutes ; )

Honestly it's not as easy as it may seems to buy the dip because one is afraid of having losses but I think it's preferable to buy the dip when it's close to a pump but regardless i go on with the mindset of always checking the charts every now and then, inorder to make sure that you ain't missing out on when you can be profitable.its just that I'm okay with this cause I'm doing this for long-term.

The option you mentioned is indeed not bad to be run by other people who do like to buy Bitcoin when the price is experiencing a price decline in the market. But the problem with such a thing is that it is not easy to find out the lowest point that you mentioned as the breakeven point because it is possible that after we buy at a certain price point, the price of Bitcoin can still go down again at the same time. So I also have a little conclusion in this case that if someone wants to buy Bitcoin without worrying about the conditions going down or up, of course he will still do it because maybe the Bitcoin he bought was to be saved into his own portfolio so that the amount could be more and also the person did not immediately sell it in the near future.

Meanwhile, for some people who may still be afraid to buy when the Bitcoin price is falling because they could lose in a moment, maybe that person only wants to trade with Bitcoin so that his own mind only thinks about small profits in a moment. In fact, if only he wanted to buy without fear and wanted to hold it for the long term, the potential for profit could also be much greater even though it cannot be ascertained accurately at the same time. Moreover, if someone has more time to continue to monitor the Bitcoin price chart in the market, of course that person should be able to have more courage to make a purchase because he already has more knowledge of the Bitcoin price that he has seen continuously in the market every day.

I think that you are describing situations that are really not very important, especially if someone is considering his bitcoin investment to be 10 years or longer. Yeah, the guy is going to have bitcoin purchases at various prices, and sure maybe he can make some of his buys at lower prices, yet each time that he buys bitcoin, he is likely ONLY buying a fraction of the amount that he is going to accumulate, and sure maybe he also ended up accumulating most of his bitcoin in his first 4 -6 years, yet if he does not have any expectation of reaching his accumulation goal in that time, there may not be ways that he can effectively alter his stash size by engaging in torturous attempts at trying to figure out short term BTC price movements and the extent to which his portfolio might be advantaged by waiting versus just ongoingly acting to buy regularly, consistently, persistently, ongoingly and perhaps even aggressively.

Quote from: Olatundespo on Today at 04:12:05 PM

Quote from: Mayor of ogba on Today at 03:28:27 PM

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You are right. When we encourage others to invest in Bitcoin, we advise them to be able to afford to lose the amount they invest and it is a fact that the chances of losing money are very low or close to zero. Depositing Bitcoin with their hard-earned money and where that money is coming from should be the right method and investment style for each investor. To avoid the mentality that when you accumulate some Bitcoin and have to fight the market crash, investors are told to invest the amount they can afford to lose. There may be some other reminders, including that they should not feel the need to sell quickly and should continue to save continuously. I think it's a struggle to invest, you should simply consider that you are on the right way and that it will get you to the point you expect.

Part of our setting of expectations should include the consideration that a variety of future BTC related scenarios could play out, and so within the variety of scenarios there are some scenarios that are better and some that are worse and some are more probable to play out and others are less likely to play out. We are not even guaranteed that one of the most probable scenarios will end up playing out.

Surely, we should be putting ourselves in a position to attempt to control which input variables that we are able to control, and surely we should be able to see that some kinds of scenarios are more probable than others, and we can monitor our progress along the way towards our goals, and we should be able to see the extent to which we remain on track, even though our projection out of our path forward becomes way more concrete when we have spent years building it as compared with when we are hypothesizing about it in the earliest of stages of getting started.

We might have some unexpected deviations along the way, so those deviations might not have been included in our earliest projections, so we then have to adapt our future projections to take account of what happened and also to take account of any other kinds of our expectations and/or understandings of the world.

Quote from: ZeroVinsonN on Today at 04:45:56 PM

Quote from: harapan on Today at 03:11:21 PM

Quote from: klaaas on April 17, 2019, 01:16:37 PM

Start buying at timed intervals, On the long run you increase your stack and got less worries about the price. It will give ease of mind to not check the charts every x minutes ; )

Honestly it's not as easy as it may seems to buy the dip because one is afraid of having losses but I think it's preferable to buy the dip when it's close to a pump but regardless i go on with the mindset of always checking the charts every now and then, inorder to make sure that you ain't missing out on when you can be profitable.its just that I'm okay with this cause I'm doing this for long-term.

If the charts were as trust worthy as they seem, every bitcoin trader would be making profit, charts aren't always right, they are rarely right infact, so knowing when its close to a pump becomes easier said than done, and thats why we should invest WITH bitcoin instead of trading with it, checking and reading charts dont guarantee investment success, reading the chart is even more detrimental to traders as they tend to make quick and rash decisions believing that a price increment is on the way, they buy, and when this price increment doesn't come, they sell due to impatience which more time than none often leads to loss.

All the charts are right, until they aren't. Cheesy