Quote from: barabbas on May 04, 2014, 08:07:53 AM

Quote from: ddeaNewtOn on May 04, 2014, 07:27:34 AM

Quote from: barabbas on May 04, 2014, 05:30:42 AM

Quote from: ddeaNewtOn on May 04, 2014, 04:51:15 AM

Quote from: barabbas on May 04, 2014, 03:08:06 AM

I have been away from here for a couple of days and frankly it's almost impossible to catch up with so many pages of related posts... Anyway, once again, fully knowing that that darts will be coming from every side, I am the self-appointed (apparently everyone is self-appointing themselves here on Blackcoin, so...) sober voice of of reason and common sense.

1.- Everyone in this forum knows that I don't see eye-to-eye with Iconic in general and that I have found most of his ideas outrageous and damaging to BC. His antics with WC and their forum and his ill-fated attempt at creating an instrument to manipulate the market cannot be defended, regardless. At the same time, his launching of the BlackCard, while (importantly) being a for profit (for his personal profit, that is) endeavor, has been praised without reservations by me numerous times. His Wall Street escorts march initiative, I have been critical about (critical in the sense of examining the pros and the cons, not necessarily on condemning it since I was and remain, on the fence if every day that passes more incline towards the negative on it). Since the community will pay for it, hey, if they do pay for it, let's see if it was wrong and, in any case, how wrong. I just lighted the red light that it could be quite disastrous fro BlackCoin's image and that the "good" that could come from it would be limited, at best. What is there to be gained from it? I still don't see what "awareness" could bring us. We are not selling anything, therefore being aware of a gloriously beautiful logo cannot possible translate into anything greatly beneficial. Would a Howard-Stern-like event be detrimental? I believe it can, but not much either so, if the few that give are for it, why not. Again, neutral on it.

I point this out because it is relevant to what comes below in which I am, almost completely, in favor of Iconic's position:

2.- I cannot be more AGAINST the PR initiative. Once again, it appears that the self-appointed BlackCoin Foundation -or in Iconic's definition "the core group" or the "IRC Boys"-, is ponying up $15,000 of their own pockets to support it because, well they think it is a great idea ... because no other crypto has done it before... err, maybe I am missing something here but that type or "originality" in and of itself, doesn't merit the initiative. What is the purpose? what is the campaign? what are we selling? One again, what is the rush? (this is and old question I initially posed to Iconic too). We are barely 2 months old, doing great. Why we need to do "original" things? what's the rush, again? who are we running from? I fail to see the need for any of this at all. I see though, other nearer and way more concerning, worrysome in fact, realities: the multi-pool is still showing that horrible patch and has no front end; more worrysome even, it's been only a few days since the pool was literally put on it's knees by a simple DDOS attack, which showed the amazing vulnerability, on one side, and made a lot of miners run away to greener, more secure ventures. While we are pursuing new visitors, it seems that we have the house dirty and stinking and that whoever that comers our way can be faced with pretty dangerous situations and circumstances...

3.- Transparence. It was nice to see the faces of three members of the dev team (or is it the Foundation?.. I'm confused -more later-? in the BlackCast -it was terrible, to say the least, that the three seemed to be paid endorses of Marlboro AND the Colorado Chamber of Commerce, but at least we saw their faces and learn a couple of first names... but other than that, there's no transparency at all here. Example: If you ask on IRC about the multi-pool, you get all kinds of "answers" from the ever-present "Soepkip" and "Gritt" to other volunteers, such as "Syllabear" and others. Depending on who answers, for instance Soepkip, you get that "the multi-pool is not directly connected with the dev team" (therefore when it fails, well, sorry but not the devs fault) or that the said multi-pool is "not vital" to BlackCoin. If Gnu or others answer, then it IS indeed vital... but still not directly connected or the responsibility of the devs... Confusing, isn't it? Then you go on and get answers -or lack thereof- to such questions as "when does the multipool buy their BCs?" (apparently -no official word on it either- "they wait for the dips", rather than buy at whatever market price it is trading the moment the coins are sold -presumibly for BTC?. Again, no official word on this. When are the miners paid? er... uh... depends on Crypsty, apparently... although officials fromn Crypsty have shown on IRC to deny -or partially deny- this. In any case, it seems that miners are paid, uh, whenever the person in charge is not too busy.... "while we develop a system that will make the payments instantaneous and the mining proceeds happen". It's all cloudy out there. No specifics, no one really responsible of anything... "it will happen", they'll tell you. Eventually.

This is in the very specifics of mining. When it comes to structure, we are lost. Now, apparently, we have a BlackCoin Foundation. Really. Land grab has been mentioned a couple times in the previous 40 pages of this forum but, let's ask: Who are the members of this Foundation? Are they the dev team? (I seem to have read that no, it's a group of BC investors). Well, since I am one such BC investor, how come nobody has asked me to join the Foundation or, at the very least, ask me if I was interested in having a foundation at all? Who decided we should have a Foundation and who are the members of that foundation. Names, real names. And wallet numbers, please. And with what criteria have they been chosen? and by who? I have to be on Iconic's side on this... all of a sudden a very aggressive and prolific campaign of posts in the forum by people that rarely if ever have posted before, are the self-appointed "BlackCoin Foundation". Who are these people and why are they "looking for our interests"? Or are they? I mean if this is a group big enough and with big enough wallets, they can manipulate at will to get the best of the markets and leave us all holding the bags? Who are they? what's their interest in having controlling power in BC? why spending $30,000 in a "branding" campaign that, at best, will bring nothing but awareness toward another copy of Litecoin with a slick logo? I mean, if they are ponying up $15,000 from their own pockets, who am I to question whatever they do in their own names? But if they do it as officially sanctioned BlacCoin Foundation, then I have some interest, direct interest, because I hold a sizable stake in this venture and I demand to know who are the "morituri's", etc. of this self-appointed foundation. Like I said, with full legal names and wallet numbers. That would be transparency.

3.- Let's be clear. And perhaps someone is going to explain to me in 10 words or less how wrong I am. BlackCoin is a Litecoin clone, with a gorgeous logo. Basically. A copy of a model (PoS) that was made public over 2 years ago (Nova) mixed with some other algos and of which there are at least 10 identical clones already out there and about 100 (a day) coming out. So, first of all and before we try the spend quite a bit of resources, why not getting to the basics? What the fuck is BlackCoin? Oh we are "fast", I get that... but isn't UltraCoin actually FASTER than BC? How much faster than LTC is BC? That is a claim that has to be true or it will backfire. But, lets assume, as some pretend, that BC is the fastest crypto in existence, how long is that claim going to remain true? Is it something we can base the "selling" of the coin on? I don't believe so. What else? Is it more secure, the most secure? How. In layman words -we are pretending to sell this to laymen, right?-. Are we a "holder of wealth" like someone has pointed, "for the wealthy"? How? with 1% annually that is exceeded by every other alto in the market? I really want the answers here, not at all trying to be negative. Exactly, in a very few words that everyone can understand, why is BC "the shit". The shit that merits public recognition through outrageous Wall Street marches and costly PR engagements determined by people of whom we know absolutely nothing about and masquerading as "The Foundation", all with an incredible craving for the coin to get to much higher prices in the exchanges and no substantial plan to actually grow it into something a small segment of the regular population will actually use some day. Picture me skeptical but all this seems designed only for the purpose of quickly -very quickly, 90 days or less- capitalize on an investment at whatever expense INCLUDING the future of the coin.

Sorry for the length. Hopefully only really interested parties would go through the whole thing. Every word is there for a reason, though... And I am not even asking for donations either.

The foundation this, the foundation that.. this that this that, okay done... If you have enough time to write a long letter about their transparency, why can't we set a time to develop the infrastructure or PR of the coin?

One thing I commend you doing is questioning the coin's details in full, that I do believe is a contribution and should be answered by someone (much more technically versed) or answered in the blackcast.

In my mind, crypto is a fast paced world. 1 week goes by with thousands of events that happen. Without something that pushes blackcoin out there, it will be drowned by the noise that is created... much like in a bitcointalk thread, so anything that happens for blackcoin, be it wallstreet event, PR event, crop circle.. anything.. it's something that someone is trying to accomplish to push blackcoin out there. Ofcourse they have their own motives to do that.

In the mean time, blackcoinpool is in the works for its x11 and Scrypt-N compatibility, head on to the IRC channel > #BCPDev if you have a miner and could help out with tests!

Well you have your opinion which is, in all and in some, as respectful as any other, no more. Same with what is "In my mind...", except that what you say it is, is quite vague and unsubstantiated. In reality, far from true that "...1 weeks goes by with thousands of events that happen..." It's simply not true. Not thousands, not hundreds, not even tens... if you are referring to anything of substance, anything with repercussions. Basically, two things happen every week: A bunch of new alts go by the bayside after initial ever so minimal splash, one, and 2, prices, generally, keep going lower for all the rest also. Those are the two events that repeat themselves weekly, if not daily, and that have real impact, real repercussions for everyone in one way or another interested in altos. Doge sponsoring a Nascar? Bah, does it affect the price? No, fuck it... irrelevant. Maybe it will win... maybe it won't. Nothing "happens" actually, ok?
There are a thousand -or more- things that DO happen and that no one knows or talks about. For instance, 1000s of miners switch from one pool to the next because a) they don't trust the accounting, the payouts; or b) the pool is less secure and/or less profitable than others. But here we seem to be worrying about everyone's dick size, how to convert "normal" people to a coin that is new and does exactly what 100 others do (with a much more beautiful logo, that goes without saying) and that no one outside of cryptoworld would ever be interested in and about spending serious money in staging stunts of one manner or other to get people to ask "what the fuck is BlackCoin?" and then, when "explained" add "ah, I heard of all these "coins" for and by crooks, no thanks".

Anyone with 5-year old knowledge of business, to the lemonade stand level, knows that ANY business has to cater to their customers, including future and potential customers. Regardless of pyrotechnics, stunts anf other gizmos, there's not one chance in hell that anyone would come to BlackCoin if not through the doors of Bitcoin. Not One. Therefore to go to Wall Street or Main Street with pretensions of "awareness" is just an exercise in futility.

Besides that, who needs it? We are doing ("we" being BlackCoin) just fine as it is, without the pyrotechnics. People that is not mining is trading/investing in the coin. It is top 10. Has been for a long time and none of the newcomers nor the established ones is even remotely threatening that 8-9 position. In spite of people in Crypto not knowing of any difference between BlackCoin and any other coin. IOn spite of having been put in our knees with the DDOS attack. In spite of having a multipool portal that looks simply shameful. In spite of miners not having been paid -as of yesterday- for days. So, clen house and stop the futility, ok?

As for the Foundation, again, if you want to be a member, THE LEAST that can be expected from you is to reveal you legal identity AND your wallet, so everyone knows your level of interest in BlackCoin and, of course, if you sell those coins and when and how many. If you refuse to make public this information, your motives are suspect and you shouldn't be a member. As simple as that. Plenty of qualified voluntaries... So, who are you, who is morituri, how many coins do you have in your wallet. No? Cant's stand the heat? get out of the kitchen. Very simple.

I'm not a foundation member mate, not looking to be one either

So... everything everyone does is just, as you say it, pyrotechnics.. by that I guess it's for show? I guess you could say that...
Alrighty then, tell me what you would want to do?
It seems that you are against each and every project that's up out there...

What would you do?
What's your reason to poke this argument further...

(please correct me if i'm wrong, no intention to offence, just to clarify)
1. transparency
2. hating the foundation & their work
3. hating IE & his work
4. wasting money?

I just want to know why are we arguing again and again about this... It's time wasted in bickering and less time in working on things we could improve as a community

Oh.. and my arguments are I thinks and maybes... but well... Sorry :p

Err no, not everything. When tech aspects such as security, reliability, access to stats by miners, etc is done properly, I applaud that. When some initiatives are clearly good, such as the BlackCard, even when done for personal profit as it is the case, I applaud that. When some of the devs come out publicly in a BlackCast, even though I deplore that they would be and advertisement for Marlboro and the Chamber of Commerce of Colorado, albeit unintentionally, I applaud that. As a matter of fact I applaud a lot... so much clapping that my hands hurt. I believe a bang up job has been done so far in the past 2 months.
To your questions?

1 .- I believe transparency is what everyone wants, no exceptions.
2.- I do not hate anything. I would like to know what is (who is) the Foundation, I have the legitimate right to demand that information, and as for their work, when they do anything I'll be either supporter or critic. So far, for the little that we know, I cannot approve of anything that a group of anonymous "investors", supposedly appointed by finger by the devs, may decide. Specifically the PR initiative, for the little that have been divulged so far, I am extremely critical, pending the rest of the very important information.
3.- IE is not a saint of my particular devotion -ok, I find the guy and insufferable egomaniac- but I'd be first in line to praise any of his positive contributions just as I'd be -and had been -first in like in deploring some of his terribly damaging ideas such as the WC incidents and the ill-fated attempt at manipulating the markets. No hate whatsoever. Once again, his PR efforts so far, some of his ideas (VofS) and the BlackCard, although for personal profit, I have been and will be first to praise.
4.- Yes I consider both the Wall Street bimbo walk and the PR initiative gigantic waste of money but, since it is not MY money, I will just be a mildly amused spectator. Cannot support what I see as intrinsically negative or wasteful, but being other people's money, hey they pay big bucks for tickets to golf that, to me, is as thrilling as watching flies fuck, so to each its own.

In closing, the arguing is motivated by very specific causes, quite legitimate, that need arguing because they affect the immediate future direction of a coin that, so far, has not needed any of these antics to have an spectacular run. Many here, me included, believe that we would continue doing just as well is nothing -that works and has worked so far- is changed and that all resources available should be employed in cleaning the house spotless before inviting any visitors in. Does it seem rational to you?

For people who keep saying I was smoking pot during the black cast, I clearly showed in the beginning it was just roll your own cigarettes. Cigarettes are 14-15 dollars a pack in NYC, roll your own is like five bucks and lasts 2 and a half packs.

It's just been bugging me, because I feel like I'm getting attacked for no reason on this issue-- seriously it was TOP brand tobacco. I don't think there is anything wrong with smoking weed, but I would not do that during my first meeting with the internet. I am a cigarette smoker, as many of us are, and to be honest, the BlackCast made me a little nervous, because I've never done a live broadcast with my face before. Cigarettes help take the edge off a little bit, I know you can't see but at the beginning I was also sweating a bit, and the smoking relaxed me and help me articulate. I know this is a silly issue to focus on, but I thought I would just clear it up.

If you re-watch the cast, it's literally one of the first things I say-- for the next cast I'm buying regular cigarettes to avoid this confusion, and to any one who thinks I shouldn't be smoking during the cast, that's your own objective and please don't project that on grown adults who can make their own decisions.

Had to get this off my chest ;P all this talk of smoking made me really crave a smoke. Thanks.