Quote from: slaman29 on June 19, 2025, 11:09:19 AM

Quote from: BenCodie on June 18, 2025, 11:23:29 PM

Quote from: slaman29 on June 18, 2025, 12:15:05 PM

And this is the thing about new tech. I can tell you 99% of business owners who accept virtual payments or have eshops have 0 idea about how it works. And they still do it.

Wouldn't that be increasing the odds of making a technical mistake or a preventable loss dramatically higher?

For many people, having a 3rd party with support is exactly why they go to it. If someone runs into a technical mistake or their card payment gets an unauthorized loss, they call the bank and get it refunded. Happens to me before, when I still had credit card. If I got scammed I simply call the bank and get a refund (chargeback). Free.

I could never do this with Bitcoin.

Imagine a shopowner, retired people, using Bitcoin purely on their own. And a customer scams them with double spend (when it was possible). Now actually still possible with some alts. Can he get insurance? Or they simply make a mistake, send a huge miners fee. Will they know how to get it back?

Solution? Use 3rd party. Solve all their need for technical awareness. Get protection.

In business and consumer, this is the mentality. So again, I say, adoption is little thing to do with awareness.

I mean look at email, few of us know how to send an actual email routing through SMTP or whatever. We just open a 3rd party email provider and tell it send our mail. In the future 99% of people will use BTC this way. Setting mining fee, coin control etc teaching people about it is not gonna make them use BTC.

Sure, and how has third parties worked for anyone in the past? Convenience does not = best. There are serious drawbacks.

No one said education was about setting mining fees or coin control either. That was just your assumption

Quote from: JiiBs on June 18, 2025, 11:34:27 PM

Quote from: BenCodie on June 18, 2025, 11:23:29 PM

Debt is slavery. I would be certain that if a survey were to be done on the population about why they own no Bitcoin, the majority of the result would be related to the debt obligations that they are more than likely struggling to keep up with. This alongside supporting family or children. My point here is that change of behavior might be desired though not possible for some.

While I might be a little optimistic about this, about the possibility that debt hinders investments which is does, I don’t really think it’s a significant purpose as to why a significant population from the world’s populace wouldn’t invest in Bitcoin. I think they just don’t invest because, they haven’t given Bitcoin much of a thought.
Let’s not forget that there are some really rich people and a few middle class people, living stable lives but, haven’t invested a penny in Bitcoin yet. What say you for those people, they are not just looking.

I completely disagree. Give everyone in the world $10,000 for free, and I'm sure at least a portion of that would go into Bitcoin by more than half of them. Lack of participation or care would be because there is no incentive to due to their financial situation, and not enough understanding as to how in the long-term, there's an incentive to hold bitcoin.

Those who are rich or middle class who aren't in, is probably because it's too complex, or they've been misinformed. I doubt many are making conscious and informed decisions to not touch Bitcoin.

Quote from: coyhasmon on June 18, 2025, 11:29:35 PM

Quote from: BenCodie on June 18, 2025, 11:23:29 PM

Quote from: coyhasmon on June 17, 2025, 01:56:12 PM

Quote from: BenCodie on June 17, 2025, 01:43:54 PM

Some people have no idea how bitcoin works, how to store it, so how can they accept it in their business or convert their wages to it without inducing themselves with anxiety or opening themselves up to vulnerability?

Just buy it through an ETF if you can't educate yourself enough or don't trust yourself to do it safely.

Trusting the very institutions that Bitcoin was designed to cut out should be a temporary solution at most.

I agree partially but you can't have such an absolute view on the matter. I don't think my grandma would be ever able to learn how to safely use and hold Bitcoin, but she can have some exposure in an ETF without an issue. Self custody is not really for everybody and we should not try to force it. We should just encourage it where appropriate.

If a grandma can operate trading facilities to buy an ETF, they can take care of a bitcoin wallet. The elderly adapted to digital banking, Bitcoin is not much different. That's my view.

No point holding an ETF if blackrock forks it and the ETF is not even bitcoin anymore (this is in their disclosure documents for the ETF terms by the way).