Quote from: Finebone on Today at 07:57:02 AM

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Hmm… you’re still not getting the point, all you need to start is that extra little money you can afford to lose which is your discretionary fund,

You have a very poor mindset of what it takes to successfully build and sustain a Bitcoin investment. First, you should adjust this mindset of investing what you can afford to lose because such mindset will only make you afraid of even investing in Bitcoin because you cannot intentionally put your money where you will lose it. There was a reason it was recommended to invest only discretionary income because that is the money you can keep

For someone who has a rich mindset of bitcoin investment and yet you don’t know what the phrase “afford to lose” means. No one goes into investment expecting to lose, that’s not what I’m talking about or what the statement means; it only means your protecting your financial well-being and managing your risk. And I even added which is your discretionary fund. Dude didn’t you see that? Or you’re trying to support what you don’t understand eh?
How are you a Senior member when you don’t understand this simple phrase ?

Discretionary income is not the amount of money an individual can afford to lose. Discretionary income is your total income minus your expenses for basic needs.

Is like you are a bit confuse here buddy, you said that discretionary income is not a money you can afford to lose, if that's the case, then what is discretionary income?
Because in still your writing, you said that discretionary income is the money left after your basic needs have been taken care of, which is very true, in Bitcoin investment it is always advisable to invest with an amount you are willing to lose, and it's only your discretionary income you can afford to lose, that is why it's recommended when you want to invest in Bitcoin, so am surprised by your statement that discretionary income is not a money you can afford to lose.

When we are referring to an amount of money that a person "can afford to lose," there is a psychological component.

Of course, a person could invest up to 100% of their discretionary income into bitcoin, yet if they make mistakes and they have no money left, then they might accidentally use money that they need for their expenses, so there can be dangers in using 100% of your discretionary income for investing in bitcoin.

Yes, you are certainly right sir, using 100% of your discretionary income to invest in Bitcoin might land you in trouble financial, but am still curious, if you already have a good emergency and reserve funds in place that can carry your financial burdens for more than 3 months, would it still be wrong to invest like 90% or 100% of your discretionary income?

By definition, you can spend your discretionary income on whatever you like, which includes investing up to 100% into bitcoin.

Personally, I think that you are lying to yourself if you are saying that you are investing 100% of your discretionary income on bitcoin, since people frequently will have some discretion in some of their expenses, so you likely have various kinds of food that are more luxurious so you are spending on food more than what you basically need. The same is true with your rent and perhaps other expenses that you have.

There are also some expenses that increase your income or increase your chances of getting more income, and sometimes you might not exactly be able to measure what makes a difference, including that there is value in eating nutritious foods that may or may not cost more, but may well improve your energy and improve your income. With utilitiesw sometimes there can be ways to save on your utilities, yet if you are paying for electricity, sometimes it will be better to spend more on electricity, and sometimes you might be able to earn more income from having a car rather than a motorcycle, even though cars cost more.

There also might be some social things that you can choose whether or not to spend money, and sometimes if you show generosity, people will like you more, help you and even end up saving you money based on your spending money on them.

Also sometimes if you wear nicer clothes, you will be invited into better quality social circles, yet still you are technically correct that you can spend up to 100% of your discretionary income on investing into bitcoin.

By the way, you seem to acknowledge the importance of the emergency funds ,yet there is also discretion in terms of how large are your emergency funds and the extent to which you refresh them and/or use them for saving up for bigger ticket items. Let's say for example you have a crappy smart phone that does not have very good functionality, and so you know that if you spend something like $500 on a new (or even a good quality used) smart phone, then you will likely become more productive and you might even be able to get some better quality work, so that instead of working 60 hours per week for your current income level, you will be able to work 45 hours per week, while earning 20% more... (maybe you need to improve your data plan to $10 more per month too - once you get the new phone. So you really want to set money aside to be able to get the new phone and the other expenses, yet you consider that you are going to need to save for a few months before you are able to accumulate enough money.. so surely you have dilemmas regarding how much of an extra fund to create or even other tactics that you might take to spend some money so that you are pretty sure that you will be able to make more money and also save some time too... such as 15 hours of more time available per week with the new arrangement. These can be tough decisions sometimes to rush a process or just to stay balanced and perhaps make the change 2-3 months down the road once you have accumulated enough savings (presumptively using your reserve funds) to get your cash level up to the amount that you have the extra $500.

Quote from: Finebone on Today at 07:57:02 AM

Another thing am curious about is, I initially thought that our discretionary income is that money we can afford to lose because it's the money left after all expenses of our basic needs has been taken care of, so I really want to know, how best can we discribe that money we can afford to lose from our weekly or monthly income?

You are largely correct that money that you can afford to lose could be up to 100% of your discretionary income, yet many times people do not think about their discretionary income like that, since an overwhelming majority of people (especially normal people) spend some portion of their discretionary income on things that they want, whether it is going out to a restaurant or perhaps buying name brand sneakers, or having a few drinks at a bar, or buying a bicycle for their niece, so there is some value in present consumption rather than future consumption that might not happen. There are also psychological components, so even if you have a lot of faith in bitcoin, you likely still need to take care of various psychological needs, so if you spent 2 years building up your bitcoin holdings, and maybe you are not really in profits, and then all of a sudden, the BTC price drops, 30% and you are pretty upset, and then it drops another 50% from the 30%, which then causes you to be right around 50% down, and then it drops another 40%, so then at that time, you are a total of 70% down, and you are supposed to be buying more BTC the whole time, and maybe you keep buying BTC, yet at the same time, you are feeling like you are running out of cash. Maybe you were investing around 20% of your income into bitcoin, but then once the BTC price started crashing, you started to put 25% to 30% of your income into bitcoin, so maybe you have invested the equivalent of 60% of your annual income into bitcoin.

You could even become psychologically weak from the whole situation, and some folks might have had been telling you not to invest so much in bitcoin and then now they are telling you "I told you so", and they are even telling your that you could have had 3x more bitcoin if you had not been so aggressive in buying bitcoin "at the top." Maybe it even takes 1, 2 or even 3 years before the BTC price starts to seem like it might have stopped dropping and staying flat... but you are still in the negative with how much you put in as compared with how much your BTC holdings are worth. If you can tolerate all that negative BTC price pressure, then sure maybe you have invested no more than you can afford to lose, but you are going to end up being financially and psychologically challenged if the BTC price moves against you... so you actually need to find some balance in which you are both financially and psychologically comfortable, which is also part of the reason that many people are not going to invest 100% of their discretionary income, and maybe they will find some way to be aggressive without over doing it, but maybe invest around 50% or 60% of their discretionary income into bitcoin.. so then they have the remainder of their discretionary income as a kinds of cushion.

Quote from: Jostern on Today at 10:50:54 AM

Quote from: Gost ms on Today at 08:39:33 AM

Quote from: Finebone on Today at 07:57:02 AM

[edited out]

Does it mean that if we invest all our discretionary income that is a bad choice of investing in Bitcoin, honestly speaking I don't think there is anything wrong if we choose to invest all our discretionary income into Bitcoin, considering that out discretionary income is money left over from our income after paying our expenses, Well I know sometimes life is unpredictable and we could make mistakes investing from our income which is meant for expenses, that is where we could fall into some trouble.
Perhaps what if an investor have a good financial management with an emergency funds and a reserved funds to help In sustaining your investment. Sometimes most folks would want to accumulate more aggressively, should that be discouraged as well because most guys would want to accumulate aggressive with all there discretionary funds, I absolutely think that investing in Bitcoin with all your discretionary income wouldn't be catastrophic considering that an investor have a good financial management. Talking about emergency funds which is meant for emergency situations we cannot dispute the fact that situation were we would attempt to use them wouldn't arise, and we also have reserved funds to also help for circumstances were you could imagine we have to access this funds, a good financial plans and management is important to sustain this situations

Surely many of us suggest to invest into bitcoin as aggressively as you are able to accomplish without overdoing it, and if you are investing 100% of your discretionary income into bitcoin, you seem to be asking for trouble... but yeah, technically, you are not, yet we all make mistakes and when you end up overdoing it, then it may well end up being worse that you ended up over doing it rather than find some level of aggressiveness that allowed for a bit of flexibility.

But, yeah in the end, you make the choices in regards to how aggressive or whimpy that you want to b4e and also if you accidentally over doing it, then you are the one who will pay the consequences.

Let's say that every week, for 52 weeks you have $100 of discretionary income (and you also have good cashflow management and back up funds in place), so one choice might be to invest $100 every week into bitcoin. Maybe another choice would be to spend $90 every week, and then hold the other $10 on the side for other possible expenses, and then if you don't have extra expenses, then every 20 weeks, once the $10 on the side reaches $200, you will spend half of it to buy bitcoin. You might be better off to invest the $90 every week and hold the $10 on the side every week rather than investing the whole $100 every week...and of course, you are completely in charge of considering those kinds of trade offs regarding your balancing your bitcoin investments with other things that could come up including maybe some miscalculations or even some buying on the dip or whatever ways that the held back funds might end up being spent.. and yeah, we are already assuming that you have regular back up funds in place.. which could also serve the purpose of the $10 in the event that you were to choose to invest the whole $100 every week rather than the $90. There is no real correct answer including you are in the best position to figure out how much you should bre protecting yourself for mistakes and/or some sudden expense that might come up, especially if you already have emergency funds and reserve funds in place.

Quote from: Tonimez on Today at 12:44:44 PM

Quote from: Jostern on Today at 10:50:54 AM

Quote from: Gost ms on Today at 08:39:33 AM

[Edited out]

Does it mean that if we invest all our discretionary income that is a bad choice of investing in Bitcoin, honestly speaking I don't think there is anything wrong if we choose to invest all our discretionary income into Bitcoin, considering that out discretionary income is money left over from our income after paying our expenses, Well I know sometimes life is unpredictable and we could make mistakes investing from our income which is meant for expenses, that is where we could fall into some trouble.
Perhaps what if an investor have a good financial management with an emergency funds and a reserved funds to help In sustaining your investment. Sometimes most folks would want to accumulate more aggressively, should that be discouraged as well because most guys would want to accumulate aggressive with all there discretionary funds, I absolutely think that investing in Bitcoin with all your discretionary income wouldn't be catastrophic considering that an investor have a good financial management. Talking about emergency funds which is meant for emergency situations we cannot dispute the fact that situation were we would attempt to use them wouldn't arise, and we also have reserved funds to also help for circumstances were you could imagine we have to access this funds, a good financial plans and management is important to sustain this situations

It seems that you either don't understand the real meaning of a discretionary income or you are mixing up things. Discretionary income has to do with the money left after attending to your basic needs or responsibilities. It is whole. This money is the one left after buying food stuffs, paying off your light bills, water bills environmental services and children's or family requirements for the period upon reception of your paycheck. Out of the discretionary income comes the emergency funds and back up funds. If you understand that emergency funds and back up funds come out from your discretionary income then you would not say that.

Investing all your discretionary income would leave you with no back up funds and emergency funds which indirectly exposes your bitcoin stash to possible premature sales when nature hits. Emergencies like health challenge and natural disasters don't announce a date, it happens. So it is advised that you only invest a percentage of your Discretionary income into bitcoin so that some percentage can be used to fortify your emergency funds and back up funds in order to be able to hold for long. Investing aggressively does not imply that you have to invest all your discretionary income or invest with your emergency funds. This is because if you intend to hold for a period of 4 to 10 years, then you must be financially knowledgeable to understand how not to invest beyond your capacity.

You have a strange way of describing emergency funds and reserve funds, since sure they come out of your discretionary funds, but once they are built then they are built.. you do not need to build them each month once they are already built unless you choose to spend from them or you might need to adjust them from time to time to account for possible changes in your expenses or changes in the ways that you calculate your expenses..