Quote from: Joeboy on Today at 08:01:57 AM

Quote from: SmartCharpa on August 15, 2025, 10:08:14 PM

Everyone has the freedom to live their life the way they want, and that also includes how they choose to use their money, whether it’s investing for the long term or taking risks in trading.

I very well agree with you on this. I read through some of the comments here( I don't need to start mentioning names), and I noticed how some persons painted trading like pure gambling, as if nothing good can ever come out of it, which for me is a very wrong way of seeing it. The truth is that trading can only feels like pure gambling when someone enters into it without knowledge, a clear plan, or proper risk management. With discipline, and then the right mindset trading is just like any other skill.

That being said, Bitcoin investments is however more preferable for me than trading Bitcoin, but that doesn't mean that trading is bad or wrong.

This thread is about bitcoin and it is also about investing, so even though we have buying the dip in the title, there is still an investing emphasis in this thread.

If you want to proclaim that trading in itself might be a good thing, you are way off topic, even if you might be able to support such a claim.

Surely many of us suggest that trading and gambling are similar in order to emphasize a point, and yeah there could be some folks who are able to figure out systems in which trading helps to hedge their bitcoin, and they may even use various financial instruments to give them options or to protect them no matter the BTC price direction, not only are those kinds of topics off topic, they would be more advance techniques that might not even be advisable to employ, even if a person might be able to figure out how to utilize them in a way that is more beneficial rather than harmful in an asset like bitcoin.

Much of the time we are talking about the various ways to accumulate bitcoin and/or even how to build and/or strengthen our cashflow management systems/practices, since those tend to be way more important skills for guys to build in the beginning of their investment and even to build and maintain if they had already been investing for decently long periods of time.

Quote from: Joeboy on Today at 08:01:57 AM

At the end of the day it all depend on your mindset and what you aim to achieve. If your goal is simply to accumulate Bitcoin over the years without worrying yourself about short term price swings, or if your goal is simply to build a long term finacial stability, then Bitcoin investment is a good fit for you.

Mindset is hopefully coupled with action, and investing can involve a lot of action over many many years, so even if we might be ongoingly buying bitcoin and shoring up our cashflow systems, we likely would not be engaging in selling, if our goal is to accumulate more bitcoin, since that might put us in the class of a trader rather than an investor..

Quote from: Joeboy on Today at 08:01:57 AM

Trading, on the other hand, is risky no doubt, but that doesn’t mean it is totally useless.

In bitcoin trading is problematic.

Think about it. Bitcoin is one of the best, if not the best, investment available, and people are going to fuck around trading it? That makes hardly any sense... especially the longer and longer that a person invests into bitcoin and builds u his bitcoin holdings, it seems quite difficult for a trader to outperform a person who is largely erroring on the side of accumlating bitcoin and just holding it.

Some people consider that they might want to learn better about bitcoin and trading, so I suppose if they limit their trading (gambling) to no more than 10% of the size of their bitcoin holdings, without cheating, then they could at least try to learn about trading without overly putting too much of their bitcoin holdings at risk. Part of the problem with the trading mindset is that it may well put guys into positions in which they start to think that 10% is not enough, so then at certain times, they are tempted to go beyond 10% because they identify "sure thing" kinds of trades (bets), and yeah, maybe 9 out of 10 times they nail their "sure things," yet it might take only one time to lose and to end up losing all of the gains from the previous bests, where it would have had been better to just stay focused on investing rather than fucking around with trading...and so they end up with way less bitcoin than what they would have had otherwise had if they had stayed focused on investing.

Quote from: Joeboy on Today at 08:01:57 AM

If your goal is to take advantage of market movement for faster profits, growing of capital in a shorter time, or you simply enjoy analyzing charts and making quick decisions, then Bitcoin trading with a solid risk management is a better fit for you

Maybe 1 out of 20 guys is ale to actually make this work in a way that is meaningful and consistent, especially over a long period such as more than a couple of cycles.

Of course in the end guys can do whatever they like, including take their chances if they think that they can beat investing into bitcoin with their trading of bitcoin techniques.

Quote from: Kelward on Today at 12:04:08 PM

Quote from: Agbamoni on Today at 09:14:36 AM

Quote from: Odusko on August 15, 2025, 09:57:47 PM

In summary, what you said above is that, bitcoin traders are also good investors, and trading does not stop one from holding some bitcoin for the long term goals, as a trader the most effective thing to do is to keep aside your trading capital and also keep your bitcoin holding capital, this way one can even use the profits their make from trading to buy and hold bitcoin at some point because it clear that trading can give you a significant profits most especially when the trader has skills and experience in the market and taking the right trading step they always be and remain in profits.

Personally I wont want to do both trading and investing at the same time. The mindset of a trader and and that of an investor is not the same. I would be astonished if anyone can comfortably do that without jeopardizing his investment or his trades. There is a saying "you cant serve two master". If we relate that to Bitcoin, we can basically be sincere that its best to either choose to be a trader or an investor. When you focus on one, and implement every strategy and show focus you will be successful in it. I can testify in investment literally.

I understand that this thread priotize Bitcoin investment over trading but yet I've seen a few guys that I know personally who combines the two and they're doing well for themselves. Although I cannot advice anybody to combine the two but it doesn't mean that a few people are not combining it and making profit. They have none custodial wallet for investment and exchange account for trading. But most people who combines them fails woefully because trading can be a distraction for most investors.

I emphasize again that I cannot advice anybody to combine trading and investment, those individuals that I mentioned are experienced trading professionals and they don't depend on trading profits to survive. A fact is that if you place trading and investment on a scale, investment weighs far better than trading because it carries far lesser risk than trading that is why Bitcoin investment is highly recommended.

I doubt that many guys are beating bitcoin investment, especially over a couple of cycles, even if they might happen to be professionals.

One of the problems of trying to live off of your trades is that you are constantly drawing from them; however, if a person had one fund that was only to support themselves, so they just withdrew from the fund for their income, and then the other fund was for trading, then that might be able to work, yet them ight have to have a decent amount of capital in the other fund that they are using to sustain themselves.

Let's say that they wanted to have a $80k income per year, then maybe they need to have 15.547 BTC in their fund that provides their income. Of course, if they ONLY needed to have $40k per year then they could half the amount in their fund that is providing their income, which would be 7.7735 BTC.

And yeah so their other funds (outside of their income fund) would be for trading and/or for their "working capital," so they would not be dependent upon any of their trading funds in order to live and so whatever bets they were to choose with their trading fund would be locked into their trading fund. They could even have their income fund with enough value to support and/or provide extra funds for their trading.. so let's say that they have a fund that has 15.547 BTC right now, and it generates $80k per year of income, yet if the guy chooses to only use $60k of that income for living, he can continue to add right around $20k per year into his trading account, to the extent that he considers that as potentially being helpful