Quote from: Forsyth Jones on Today at 06:51:45 PM

Bitcoin is neutral when it comes to transactions. Bitcoin doesn't ask for your name, check your documentation, or check whether your name is registered with OFAC before making a transaction. However, Ledger is going against Satoshi Nakamoto's principles. He created Bitcoin to be neutral.

Furthermore, it seems that the restriction imposed only applies to Ledger Live, but what guarantees me that in the future, some government will pressure Ledger to censor users or even seize funds from users who interact with sanctioned addresses or those with a high AML score? Who knows, maybe this is the real purpose of ledger recover?

Can you understand how dangerous this is?

Let's talk about that.

Here are some quotes on the subject, taken from a Youtube video interview with Ledger CEO Pascal Gauthier:

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Rodolfo Novak: "Isn't it an issue now that you have the KYC plus the Bitcoin, together? Right, because just losing the KYC... it's a problem, it sucks, right? But you don't lose the Bitcoin. Now, (because of Ledger Recover) you have the KYC plus the coins."

Pascal Gauthier: "...so?"

SOURCE

"So?" makes it very clear that Ledger either doesn't understand how dangerous this is, or Ledger doesn't care.

Ledger's CEO even said, if you care about your privacy, don't use Ledger Recover:

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"If, for you, your privacy is of the utmost importance, please do not use that product, for sure."

SOURCE

...but here's what he didn't say: The code required for key extraction from Ledger devices is part of Ledger's firmware. It's baked in. And the firmware is closed source, so there's no way to prove it can't be accessed remotely by Ledger, their partner companies, or hackers.

Can't prove it?

Can't trust it.

One of Ledger's founders even said:

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"There's no backdoor and I obviously can't prove it"

SOURCE

He can't prove it because their code is closed source. Trezor, ColdCard, Jade, Seedsigner, and Krux can all prove what their code does, because every line of their code is published and verifiable. Ledger can't because theirs isn't.

It gets worse though.

Ledger Recover involves other companies. What happens if those companies are asked by a government to give access to your keys? Here's what Ledger's CEO says:

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"These companies are not slaves to Ledger. We just have commercial agreement."

-- Ledger CEO Pascal Gauthier

SOURCE

"Great, so now the Department Of Justice calls you and says "We are charging so and so with X, Y and Z. Get two of your vendors to send us the Bitcoin keys."

-- Harry Sudock

SOURCE

The more you think about it, the more you'll realize that Ledger's key extraction scheme is poison. And since Recover is baked into their closed source firmware, it means Ledger's firmware is poison.

Here's a question I have yet to see anybody ask: What if a government asks Ledger to use Recover to extract the keys of a Ledger user who doesn't subscribe to Recover? The capability is on their Ledger device whether they subscribe to Recover or not.

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"I said government could get access to the backups of a user, as it's only a matter of law and is about one user"

-- murzika, Ledger Co-Founder, Former CEO, and Former Chairman

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"If you are referring to Ledger Recover, a joint government task force could access a user's recovery backup. I mean it's just a question of law, two shards could be subpoaned even if they are each in a different jurisdiction."

-- murzika, Ledger Co-Founder, Former CEO, and Former Chairman

SOURCE

...but, again, I need to point out that the capability is built into the firmware regardless of whether or not the user subscribes to Recover. I see no reason why a government can't force access to a user's device, since remote access to the device is baked into Ledger's firmware.

This goes back to what you said:

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Can you understand how dangerous this is?

Absolutely. Ledger's closed source code is very dangerous.

Most people haven't even begun to think through the implications of having remote access to the user's keys baked into the firmware on the hardware wallet.