Quote from: Xhowdhury on Today at 11:34:39 AM

Quote from: ASloveapg on September 21, 2025, 07:30:01 PM

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Most people agree that borrowing to buy volatile assets like Bitcoin is risky. What I will add is that first, investing with debt is like buying a lottery ticket. You have to win it before you can repay the loan.

You are not completely correct.

You can borrow money in order to be able to front load an investment with income that you have not yet earned and/or received.

Quote from: Xhowdhury on Today at 11:34:39 AM

Then the natural rule of holding Bitcoin for the long term does not hold. Your mind is unstable, when will the price of Bitcoin increase and when can it be sold. Sometimes the lender will pressure you so much that you cannot hold it for the desired period of time. This damages your financial condition as well as your mental health.

Hopefully before you carry out a loan, you understand the terms of your loan and that the terms are acceptable.

Quote from: Xhowdhury on Today at 11:34:39 AM

Secondly, Bitcoin is compared to gold as a store of value. Which is what almost everyone compares. But have you ever seen someone buying gold with debt?

There likely have been people using debt to buy gold, especially if they believe that they are in a period in which gold prices are about to go up, yet, sure, it may well make less sense to borrow money to invest in gold since gold is largely a mature asset class that may not have as much chance of upside.

Quote from: Xhowdhury on Today at 11:34:39 AM

Actually, no one does that. It seems completely unreasonable. If we consider it unreasonable to buy a stable asset like gold with debt, then taking a loan to buy a volatile asset like Bitcoin seems even more unreasonable to me. What do you think?

You are arguing nonsense, even though sure it might not be a good idea to take out loans to buy bitcoin, yet you surely have not argued any kind of a convincing point of view.

Quote from: Xhowdhury on Today at 11:34:39 AM

That's why my personal opinion would be that Bitcoin is a technological opportunity that will create opportunities for many generations. So it's best to take the time to build up an emergency fund and gradually enter the Bitcoin market with the extra money.

This part is true. Bitcoin remains one of the best, if not the best, of investments that is widely available to everyone and anyone, so long as they have discretionary funds, and there could be ways to screw up an otherwise great (and likely winner) investment by being too greedy.

Quote from: gracreavix on Today at 01:10:18 PM

.............If you invest and keep staring at the chart every hour, it will drain you and might even push you to sell too early. The people who win big with Bitcoin are usually the ones who manage both their money and their emotions..

Frequently, I consider that if any of us put our finances in a good place, then our psychology will become stronger from having had put our finances in good order.

In regards to bitcoin, we can attempt to prepare ourselves financially and psychologically for the BTC price to move in either direction, and if our finances are set up solidly (whether it is merely buying BTC every week no matter the price), then we are less likely to be bothered when the price moves in a direction that is opposite to our preferences.

Quote from: Alonso_ on Today at 01:37:05 PM

Quote from: JayJuanGee on September 23, 2025, 09:19:35 PM

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You’re correct, and I’m glad you did breakdown this to my understanding, mostly I have been struggling with my expenses and how to manage my expenses have been a hugely difficult stressful and challenging situation, it’s very important for an investor that have that mindset of buying and accumulating bitcoin for a very long term should be able to identify his basic needs, because basic needs are something that we can’t do without, now let me consider that I have to pay for my expenses of basic needs which paying for my rents is a basic expense and probably I have to pay a certain amount of money for that in a monthly basis, and even if I have to pay yearly I will have to save some money little by little for it, and also I will have to pay for my food, because for sure I will have to eat to have energy to survive and hustle for more money, and considering if I have a family I will also have to put them into consideration of groceries and food stuffs available, and also paying for utilities and also paying for gas, which falls into the category of my transportation and very important my phone bills and internet, which are all essential and basic needs.

When you decide to invest into something like bitcoin, it becomes more important to attempt to practice organizing your expenses and categorizing them, since sometimes you might not realize when you have opportunities to save money and/or maybe to get better quality products.

Let's say that you had been shopping at a local supermarket for various food items, yet you found out that a local farmer had basket deals that would constitute more than a month of various products that were better quality and maybe even better quantity for your family, yet you worked out a deal with another family that you would share in the package deals, and you would buy them every couple of weeks and that way the food is more fresh but your splitting the cost with the other family resulted in your being able to get much better food...

or maybe you found out from a co-worker that he was willing to drive, so it ended up being a few guys sharing the cost of transportation, which causes your work-related transportation costs to go down by 70%

or maybe you found out that your employer had a side project that would cause you to have to work around 15 hours extra each week, so you would receive more pay, but at the same time, if you involve yourself in the side project, you have opportunties to receive a promotion.

Maybe before you got into bitcoin, you would have had considered that it was not worth it to try to cut your expenses and/or to improve your income, yet once you started investing in bitcoin, you started to consider that any of your extra value that you were able to generate through increased income or decreased expenses was going to likely end up either flowing into bitcoin or to buttress up your back up funds so that you felt that you had enough extra money to cover you in the event that there might be some times that your expenses go up and/or your income goes down.

Quote from: Alonso_ on Today at 01:37:05 PM

However I think after figuring out our basic essential needs I think we can now fully comprehend and understand how much we are supposed to be left with our discretionary income, well sometimes it’s mostly possible that we would end up not having enough discretionary income because of the amount of basic needs that we have available, and we can also try to figure out our financial situation and apply some financial management, more like if we have some expenses that we think that isn’t necessarily necessary then we can decide to adjust with them,

There could be some situations in which you find out that you could completely cut some of your expenses or buy a different brand product or maybe finding out that one of your relatives was willing to give away some clothes that your kid could use, rather than your having to buy those kinds of clothes.

Or maybe you realize that instead of going out to eat three times a month, you could go out twice a month.

Sometimes cutting can be difficult, and sometimes it can be difficult to figure out ways to generate extra income. I know that when i was younger, I purposefully rented a place that was much larger than what I needed in order that I could rent out one of the bedrooms, and so that really worked out well for me over the years to be able to save money like that, even though there was some inconveniences that came with sharing, yet I likely had much better lodging (a larger place that I chose), and overall cheaper rent so that I could use the saved money to invest. With the rental situation, there were some times in which I had a vacancy, so then during those times, I was paying more until I was able to find a suitable replacement... yet overall I was able to save a lot of money through the years with that way of dealing with my lodging - which was the most expensive item in my then monthly budget.

Quote from: Alonso_ on Today at 01:37:05 PM

And also try to apply some strategies of how to create some different cashflow or probably increase our cashflow but working on other little details, it is true that we wouldn’t be able to choose the amount of discretionary income that we would have available, because of the amount of our expenses which we can’t probably avoid paying for them, because I think there are things that we can afford to avoid and there are also things that we wouldn’t neglect, so since discretionary income are just income left over after paying for our basic expenses then we can always decide to invest or whatever we fill comfortable that is why we can always try investing in bitcoin with our discretion income.

The more we practice and we are interactive with our finances, then we are likely able to identify opportunities to buy bitcoin, and so maybe in the past whenever we would get a bonus at work (like $500), we would immediately think about what we could buy or how we could spend it, yet once we have bitcoin as an option, even if we might not put the whole $500 bonus into bitcoin, we might consider ways to at least put some of that bonus money into bitcoin, where in the in the past we would not have had considered investing the money rather than just spending it right away.

Quote from: Ruttoshi on Today at 03:38:37 PM

Float is the money kept aside for unexpected expenses during the week that you didn't budget for and not to accumulate bitcoin during the bearish period.

I like to consider the float money as money that you have received but are not yet able to determine if you are going to need it for expenses or if you can plug it into your discretionary funds.

Let's say for example you have difficulties determining your utilities since the company is inconsistent with the way it charges. There are some months where they only bill you $20, yet there have been other months where they bill you up to $200, so each month when you get paid, you keep the full $200 in your bank account, and you wait until the utility company sends the bill. Once the amount is resolved, then you can put whatever had been extra into your discretionary funds.

You could also use the concept of float to carry over to the next month, since maybe you had some construction and/or maintenance work done on your house (and your property), and the various contractors had told you that it would cost anywhere between $200 and $900 each month for 3 months, depending on parts and also depending on how the contractors are billed for the various supplies or how many workers they have, and your contractor prefers to get paid within a week of his giving you the bill. You agreed to the contract and to the work since you believe that the contractors do good work, even though each month is uncertain regarding how much the bill is going to be for that month, and so maybe you might carry some of that money over to the next month yet once all of the billing is resolved, then whatever money is left over, then you will be able to put the extra into your discretionary funds. Once the money is in your discretionary funds it can be used to consume, save or invest.