Quote from: p1nky on May 31, 2014, 09:35:00 PM

Quote from: mumbly on May 31, 2014, 01:38:44 PM

Hey p1nky,

Bare with me buddy. To be completely honest, I'm a little frustrated tonight, but it's not pointed in your direction, just the thread mood in general.

...

Hi mumbly,

I can understand your frustration to some degree. It is always painful to put effort into something and then just see a negative feedback (even if it's not even related to what you are doing directly).

I have been joining this crypto world just a few months ago and don't really know that much. However it seems to me that developers showing an effort and being open plays a very important role for such coins to build up hype but probably even more importantly also show that you can trust in the coin. Money is a convention that in itself is worth almost nothing, but only because most people believe it is worth something. This is the same with cryptocoins. People need to believe that a HVC coin they have is worth something, and also how much it is worth.

How much it is worth is determined by what you can buy for it, apparently a not so easy long term goal for most coins, and I am glad you are working on that, because this is of course very important for the long term success of this coin.
How much it is worth is also determined by how many coins there are and how many there will be shortly. This is really also a main factor.

Now we had the situation that the main page for this coin shows info that is incorrect. It shows 56 days for the soon to be effective limit phase. As we have determined in this thread it will however be 88.1 days.
This might seem an unimportant number on some page in the internet for someone. But it is the information given on the main page of this coin for one of the most important factors determining how much such a coin is worth. And as we have seen the number of coins we will have is significantly influenced by this number.

Take for example reborn, who just stated he votes 1024 in order to have the mint phase ended as soon as possible in order to put a stop to the inflation as soon as possible. Do you think having 85.1 days more of heavy inflation instead of the previously anticipated 53 days is just some "minor number" for him? Anyone investing in this coin, who made the decsion to invest in it based on the expected supply determined by the information given on the main page, for any of these persons learning about some "minor mistakes" it could be earth shattering for the trust this person has in this coin. He could lose his trust, dump his coin, lower the price, and thus lowering the chances of this coin becoming a success.

And because this coin from a technical point of view seems to be working fine, allows energy efficient mining, and has some other things in the "pro" column, it would be a damn shame if it failed, just because the devs are too damn lazy to put the correct information up there.

In my opinion being as open and correct and fast as possible when answering questions, putting up necessary information, and correctiong mistakes, is 100x more important for the success than having some quiz game in order to produce posts in this thread so that the coin doesn't seem completely dead.

Take another example that I just discovered about the limit phase:
Page says "0 − 64,999,424 HVC" will be generated in Limit phase.
Page says "63,476 blocks" will be generated in Limit phase.
Page also says "The second phase (Limit) allows a maximum vote of 1024 HVC for the first 59,876 blocks, but 8 HVC for the last ~3,600 blocks so it can transition into to the last phase (Sustain). The Sustain phase allows a maximum vote of 8 HVC."

BUT: my Excel says: (63,476 - 3600) * 1024 = 61,313,024 plus 3600* 8 = 28,800 and in total this is 61,341,824 ... and NOT the 64,999,424 it says on the page.

So that means maximum total supply in the end will be 3,657,600 less than anticipated, ending not with 128M coins (max) but instead 124,342,400.
Which in this case probably is a GOOD thing. But it's a BAD thing we do not have the correct information up there.

Also if I may suggest something: having a "real" site for this might also sound more trustworthy than having a subdomain on github. Something like www.heavycoin.info or so.

p1nky

The discrepancy comes from the formula Keccak wrote on page 280 of the thread....

Quote from: keccak512 on May 25, 2014, 05:01:17 PM

The equation you are looking for

Code:

main.h:62:static const int64 MAX_MONEY = (PHASE1_MONEY + PHASE2_BLOCKS*MAX_VOTE + (nBlockRewardVoteSpan + 1)*MAX_VOTE + PHASE3_MONEY) * COIN;

Missing from your calculations is (nBlockRewardVoteSpan + 1)*MAX_VOTE
A special voting interval needed to make sure the block reward decreases from 1024 down to 8 before the sustain phase starts; otherwise you could start the sustain phase with 1024 block reward, which would be bad...

you gets

Code:

MAX_MONEY = 53000000 + (63476 - 3600 - 1)*1024 + 3601*1024 + 10000000 + 576 = 128,000,000

This has been on the "About" page from day one: https://heavycoin.github.io/about.html#decentralised-voting

Quote

The second phase (Limit) allows a maximum vote of 1024 HVC for the first 59,876 blocks, but 8 HVC for the last ~3,600 blocks so it can transition into to the last phase (Sustain).

There is a discrepancy on whether the last 3601 block are limited to 8 or 1024. Keccak formula above says 1024 for those blocks, but the quote on the site says 8 for those transition blocks. The difference in supply is...

3601 * 1024 = 3,687,424
vs
3601 * 8 = 28,808