Quote from: dooglus on June 05, 2014, 06:09:35 AM

I'm not sure Ivey admits to using edge sorting. The story I heard suggests that the dealer was colluding with him, placing the high cards upside down in the deck for him. That would probably be considered closer to "cheating" than "advantage play" wouldn't it?

http://apheat.net/2013/05/11/phil-ivey-won-7-8-million-pounds-by-edge-sorting-baccarat/ From what i heard, the rules of the game were agreed upon before hand which included that his requests to the dealer to flip certain cards would be upheld. The casino must have thought it was a superstitious ritual and not know that it could allow him to perceive small defects in the cards.

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Poker is the most obvious +EV game in land casinos. You're playing against other customers with the casino taking a rake, so as long as you're a good enough players that you can beat your peers and beat the rake, you make a profit.

yes agree! but this game has an element of skill which affects EV.

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Blackjack is another obvious example if you can find a game where you can count cards. I used to count cards at Bitcoin casino strikesapphire.com until they changed the penetration and banned me. Made a few hundred dollars, withdrew into five dollar Bitcoins and hedl.

also agree! counting on online gambling sites is just too easy as well. You could set up a bot to give you the exact count and EV and perfect bet amount based on kelly. i'm not surprised they quickly changed their game after that and banned your IP. you're too smart for them!

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And a third example is sign-up bonuses. If a casino offers you 2x your deposit as a sign-up bonus, it's often +EV if you play the right games. They often make you play through the bonus 20 times or something, in the hope that that's enough to make you lose it, but unless the edge is 5%, your expectation is positive even after playing through it 20 times. You need to do the math carefully, but it's possible to find +EV promotions.

Some places offer "no zero" roulette, where all bets pay out their actual fair odds. You get 36x for a single number for example. That's a zero house edge. I've seen it suggested that it's +EV for the house because people play until they bust, but I don't believe it. I think it's offered as a loss-leader to get new customers, and then withdrawn in the hope that they'll play "proper" 2.7% edge roulette.

definitely have seen +EV signup bonuses, sometimes used as loss leaders or just management ignorant of the math behind the scenes. I always feel great when i can find a good deal. even if its just for a hundred or so dollars. haha!

and I don't believe 0% roulette could ever be +EV for the house, at least not from the winnings directly from that game. I'd hesitate to offer that the variance of the game would wreak more havoc than the winnings would provide comfort. But overall, as long as its doing its job as loss leader, and bringing players to play other games, it might be worth it. Just keep the limits lower on that 0% table. I remember reading some scientific paper that if the bankroll of the player is bigger than the house, the player will bankrupt the house playing 0% odds. i'll try to search for that paper.