Quote from: ElGrandJefe on December 18, 2014, 03:43:23 PM

Quote from: MrTeal on December 18, 2014, 02:31:13 PM

Quote from: ElGrandJefe on December 18, 2014, 02:12:03 PM

I know the point that you're trying to make, but I'm afraid it's not valid.

If you're not shipping from stock, you're taking preorders, whether you have the specs are not.

This is only fair, because anyone can say "we have the specs" and "we've taped out", even though they don't and haven't (see BFL, BA).

I'd disagree on that to a point. If the spec is known on a chip but a product hasn't been finalized and produced, I would agree that it's still a preorder.
Once you're producing and shipping them, if demand exceeds supply and you run out of stock, sales going forward would be backordered. That's pretty standard in every other tech industry that for an existing product if it's not in stock it's backordered.

The problem with preorders is that they shift the risk of development onto the customer. Any delays in the development cycle (or underperformance in the final system) are usually borne without compensation by the consumer. A backorder is different since the only real risk is meeting production and shipping deadlines.

If SP (or anyone else) runs out of product and advertises it as "not in stock, usually available in 2-4 weeks" that's no longer a preorder, and if they miss the stated timeframe for shipping that should affect the On Time category, not the preorder category.

"Having the specs" isn't the same as "having the chips and boards and then running out because your suppliers can't keep up with your orders". That's what I meant.

But if you're collecting a bunch of orders and THEN using that money to buy the components, you have a pre-order model.

Quote from: Pentax on December 18, 2014, 03:05:34 PM

How is company size determined?

Yeah, BA gives the impression that they're three guys working out of the back seat of somebody's car, who occasionally order some contract assembly work. I'd like to hear how they got classified as "Large".

Yep, I'd agree. They've outsourced assembly, which it seemed they were going to do in-house by touting a huge capacity, which it turned out they apparently didn't have, then they outsourced their rent-a-minion to a 'partner', which is also something that they seemingly made it appear as if they'd be doing themselves by commenting multiple times on the ramp up of the data center, saying at one point it was done, then it wasn't (saying it didn't exist so they couldn't be self mining, after saying it did, which is a whole other can of worms) now they've outsourced it, apparently.

I don't think they actually fabricated any of the components and they're not even assembling what they've designed, assuming they actually did the design, although I think at one point they had to bring in outside help to solve one or more problems. They don't seem to be hosting any of the rentaminion contracts that they sold, so, to me, it looks like only a handful of people involved.

I guess I'm just wondering how the rating is formulated in general and how it is assessed. Not jumping on Dogie's ass, just curious about what constitutes a given ranking, ie, is 'large' 20 employees, 50 employees, etc. and how that is determined.