Quote from: digicidal on December 19, 2014, 10:38:25 AM

Quote from: dzimbeck on December 19, 2014, 09:11:43 AM

This this a complete assumtion. 100% incorrect buddy. I'm one of the only devs in the world to be this transparent. I went above and beyond, just not on this thread. Read this and eat your own words... http://www.reddit.com/r/BitBay/comments/2p90g5/official_statement/

Also, dont defend barrabas, read a few posts back, he is a Bob profile. barrabas would also say things that only Bob knew from a private phone convo.

As far as distribution is concernded did you know that someone probably currently holds roughly 20% of BC? (blackwavelabs)
Did you know that when BC started someone held about 75% of it? (blackhandgroup)
Distribution of coins is never going to be even if anything Bay is distributed no differently than any other coin.

While I certainly would not agree that "Bay is distributed no differently than any other coin", I do appreciate your post on reddit - it clears up some things from your side. I didn't bother to go through the rest of the addresses, but I presume there are 10-11 with ~8M BAY in each?... so that's the 90M you refer to in this post:

Quote from: dzimbeck on December 11, 2014, 09:55:31 PM

OK we will catch Bob in the first lie. I have roughly 90 million BitBay. And I can prove it with addresses. I have never sold a single one. They were bought for me. So again nice try.

You also received BTC from the ICO (as you should have - I'm not disputing that one bit)... in fact, you should have gotten a whole lot more, since they leveraged your name/reputation/software... basically your everything. What you got was no where close to covering what you will have to defend forever likely.

However, one point still seems to elude you (or at least eludes me since you haven't provided any evidence to the contrary):

Where did those BAY come from? They were bought during the ICO, correct? They were purchased by 'the team' (regardless of which specific individuals we're referring to) correct? So did any of those people receive so much as a single BTC from the ICO proceeds? As an investor, particularly one that was very vocal in support of you until the truth came out - this is the one question that you have not now, nor seemingly will ever answer clearly.

If any of the team paid BTC into the ICO and received BTC back again... then they got free BAY - which is the same as a premine (and perfectly acceptable if disclosed). As importantly, since that artificially inflated the ICO, because they weren't purchased by new hands - coins that should have been burned, were in fact simply kept by the team. This deflated the value of investor-held BAY, but did not deflate the value of your own - how could it, since it was free?

I'm well aware of the history of BC as I was there from day 0 mining it and buying it... what happened with BC was a shame, but until I see conclusive proof that rat4 was a primary player in it - it's not the same thing as this is. If you have proof that the 'blackhand' group worked with rat4 directly and that he was paid BC/BTC then you need to publish - but until then, I will continue to believe that he was 100% innocent of that, and the rest was simply market manipulation from a group who picked the right coin at the right time to make the PnD of all time happen. (Or more accurately the DnPnD of all time). Wink

...But this isn't about BC - BC wasn't an ICO, Pavel didn't get free BC from buying BC and then getting his BTC back. As far as Blackwave Labs is concerned... so?? Just like everyone else (other than you, Steven, Lin, and Bob's group in the case of BAY) they bought their BC on the open market, for current market prices, and they didn't get to keep the BTC they bought it with! I'm perfectly fine with their BC, just as I'm perfectly fine with your BC - because in both cases they're the same as my BC.

What is different is that my BAY was never (even from day 1) the same as your BAY.

While I appreciate your transparency now, and I certainly hope your development is successful - because we do really need these markets - you seem to consistently play the martyr on this. If you had been even 25% transparent (in the beginning) you wouldn't have to be any more transparent now. It's not the ones that got scammed fault that you're the one being suspected here! It would be a little gratifying to hear you represent a little more humility and acceptance of that fact - YOU vouched for a scam, and now you present the attitude that the only one that is the victim was YOU.

WTF? SMH. Roll Eyes

Let me distill that for you to two honest scenarios:
1) If the Bitbay team had received only BTC from the ICO and no BAY at all - then you could have bought as much BAY as you felt was reasonable after the markets opened. In fact, that would only have meant price-support and shown confidence in the long-term prospects of the coin. Likely would have meant that many BAY would be destroyed, but that also would help the price and confidence.

2) Disclosed up front that there would be a premine (you wouldn't have to say how it would be split, just that there was one) of ~40%, then gotten those coins for free and held the ICO for only the remaining 600M BAY... and burned the unsold coins at the end. You would likely have sold far fewer BAY during the ICO, but for those that still felt it was an acceptable risk... they would stand to hold a larger percentage after the destruction of the unsold amount (and so would you).

Neither of these things happened... correct?

OK first of all, I dont believe for a single second rat4 knew about blackhand. Not even Josh believed it. He found out later The same way I did.

In fact, maybe that is the perfect analogy. Nobody believed in blackhandgroup, nobody believed IE and barrabas were related, nobody believed there was a plan to sabotage BC. But there was! I had no clue how many enemies I had before this project. This project was set up by some people who clearly wanted me out of crypto. I'm not playing martyr, I can prove it beyond the shadow of a doubt. Their own group leaked it to me.

Maybe at some point i will have to leave crypto. At a bare minimum I can honor my current obligations.

When i was offered 10% of Bay by Steven, I thought they were buying it with their BTC. Only when the ICO started did I realize that wasnt the case.
My reluctance to expose it earlier (and by the way, I was the one to expose the entire scandal)... my reluctance was that they would do something like this. Anything that I discovered in the ICO phase would damage investors. So to be honest, I was trying to protect everyone involved including investors. I broke my silence because Bob was selling his Bay and provoking me with schill accounts.

The reason i was in a rush to get pegging started was to protect investors. And hell no I didnt want free Bay. I would rather burn my goddamn bay(although what use is it now? Bounties?). Why do you think i didnt sell any?? I could have tried to stop the ICO in the funding phase but that still would have impacted everyones reputation in the same. (although i do agree with you here, I should have done it the second i noticed it) It upsets me that 4 other people just made a bunch of BTC on my name. It was exactly what I didnt want.

At least Steven is willling to fund the joint account and work on the project with me from here. (So he says) and at least I can fulfill my obligation to do exactly what I said I was going to do.

But never in a million years did I think the entire project was a premeditated plan by my enemies to interfere with Halo. (in some ways, its better that i realize how important Halo is now then later)

The major mistake I made was not interfering with the financial end of it. But considering BTER was holding on to funds, I thought it would be OK. Kind of ironic I didnt use BitHalo to eliminate middle men. Looks like I should have been using my own tool.

Better late than never. I use BitHalo for everything now. I just set up a joint BitHalo account with Steven and that number was disclosed in the thread on reddit.