Quote from: ibminer on December 19, 2014, 06:17:23 PM

I do believe there is an overseeing entity of our planet and our "species", and I am hoping its not a bunch of fucked up humans trying to control the decency of humanity. Although, currently, I haven't come to a conclusion one way or the other as to who or what that entity may be.

I will say I am beginning to think the Bible was created or evolved into a control mechanism for people. Although, I am struggling with whether or not its a necessary control to have a somewhat functioning & pleasant society. Trust me, I am not one to want any regulation or control over anyone but there are certain groups of people that I know would do evil things if they didn't have some type of spiritual accountability hanging over their head.

My fear is if God disappears from societies, and there is no personal fear or accountability for ones actions outside of law enforcement, I think the society may break down or at least turn into a society I may not want to be a part of.

I still continue to not be able to understand the arguments of most of the religious groups out there that read the Bible as if it is some type of manual for life. Some of my concerns with the Bible stem from the fear that the people, at the time of Jesus, were not intelligent enough to determine whether or not they were being tricked into seeing or believing things that weren't actually happening. However, I do believe some were intelligent enough to deceive and manipulate.

Also earlier in time, how do I know Moses didn't fall and whack his head on a rock and get some type of brain damage that made him delusional before he, or whoever, wrote those first set of books?

The earliest accounts of the Bible apparently came from songs, poetry and other hand-me down stories that had been passed down verbally through multiple generations. We have those hand-me down stories all the time, even today, and what worries me is they can lose their original value or meaning even within a few generations of being passed down, lyrics and stories change slightly as they are passed along through generations.
I wonder if the Itsy Bitsy Spider song is related to the great flood??? Is the spider resembling human kind going into the gutter (sinning) and then being washed away with water?? only to repeat the process after the sun comes back up?? Shocked

The Bible seems to have been started around 1500BC. The creation stories date back to 4000BC (I will note here that the Bible technically doesn't say when the creation stories come from). It is worrisome to think that these stories were verbally passed down through at least 1500 years before being written into the first books of the Bible. Could we not be worshiping twisted versions of old tales that parents told their children, or their people, to keep them in line before the great flood? And after the great flood, those stories then became real to the survivors who believed a naturally occurring event was caused by God?

I also fear our ancestors may have reached a point in mental/psychological evolution where they needed a God and an explanation of their existence and thus mentally created one through these stories. Maybe Moses picks up on these stories after the flood and starts writing about them?

I feel there IS some truth in the Bible, but it also appears to be a cluster-fuck of books that seem to sometimes contradict prior books and the values the books preach about.

Here are a few more questions for any overly religious folks out there

1) Why are their human fossils and other evidence being found that predate the creation week? Including underwater volcanoes and other things that have erupted, supposedly before water or land ever existed.

2) Why would Jesus question Cain as to where his brother is when he speaks to Cain in the field? Shouldn't Jesus know Abel is dead??? Also, why the hell would Cain get to walk away from a murder and be allowed to go build a city?
---It sounds like some guy killed his Brother and then made a deal with Jesus to build a city and Jesus would allow him to live by telling people they would be punished seven times worse.

Also...... a note for any religious health folks out there: Jesus accepted the fat from a sheep and rejected the fruit. Wink

There are unfortunately plenty of murderers who have not been caught, and plenty of people around that have caused the death of many people. Look at some of the dictators in the world who live long luxurious lives while breaking almost every commandment. We seem to be taught that all things will be justified in death, and that those sinners won't make it to the promise land but that's a hard pill to swallow with some of the tragedies I have personally seen in my own life and in others.

3) Why would a God create an Earth in the fashion that its laid out in the Bible, what is the motive??

I'm done ranting.

This was also interesting to look at, hopefully its all accurate! Lips sealed

I am not overly religious but I am Christian and ill try to addresses these issues you put up the best I can.

1. If you read Genesis it is written a lot like a poem more than a history book and some Christian philosophers believe it was written as a peom not an actual account and you can tell this because the rest of genesis doesn't talk in such a manor. I myself believe in evolution and still believe in god.

2. Jesus wasn't around yet it was god not the son of god. He didn't get to walk away he was cursed and couldn't be murdered by anyone so he became nomadic. God was testing him to see if he would tell him what he had done but he didn't so god punished him. also about the health folks part Historically being fat was good because in times of famine the extra fat would help you but nowadays that isn't the case also Cain offered the fruits in a disrespectful manner while abel gave his best sheep in a very gracious way. So it doesn't have anything to do with weight just about respect.

Yes it is true that many bad things happen and that many bad people get away with it sometimes people let other people get away with it such as U.S supporting a country with oil that has a dictator and as long as the dictator is giving oil he will stay in power. and this is a hard pill to swallow but eternity is a lot longer than you or I could imagine.

3. As I have said before it appears in more of a poem fashion than an actual account. also god created the world to benefit humanity but when humans broke gods word they were sent out of Eden.