well, we will probably never know. Is everybody sure that it can only be a good thing or is there the possibility that some people try to trick users and influence the price to finally take their profit like vampires and leave the HZ users sucked empty and finally destroyed? Sorry, but obviously I don't have much trust in the cryptocoin-world. Probably I feel the same towards cryptocoins as many cryptocoin users feel towards "normal" money and banks... Is this "FUD"? Yes, I learned FUD from cryptocoins, I call it realism...

Tja, "es gibt Schlimmeres" ist ein tolles Argument. Sicher finde ich es auch schlimmer, jemanden zu foltern und ihm anschließend den Kopf abzuschneiden, als einen Doktortitel zu erschleichen. Aber wenn ihr auf solcher Grundlage diskutieren wollt, bitteschön, dann bin ich hier raus.

Anscheinend hat sich hier noch keiner ehrlich abgerackert, dass so etwas entschuldigt wird. Und klar denken ist anscheinend auch nicht so drin. Es ist Betrug, Punkt. Die Regeln sind eindeutig und bei allen Universitäten gleich.

Dass es deswegen keine Straftat ist, bleibt aber auch richtig, weil Straftaten nun mal im Strafgesetzbuch geregelt sind. "Betrug" ist aber ein allgemeiner Begriff, und nicht jeder allgemeinsprachliche Betrug ist gesetzlich gesehen eine Straftat. Aber das ändert nichts an der Verwerflichkeit. Das ist aus meiner Sicht sogar verwerflicher als so manche "offizielle" Straftat.

Den Unterschied zwischen Berufsausbildung und akademischem Titel sehe ich überhaupt nicht, das ist doch eine ganz klare Weiterqualifikation. Einen Doktortitel zu kaufen ist das Gleiche wie einen Meistertitel zu kaufen oder irgendeine andere Berufsbezeichnung. Außerdem würde der Ghostwriter ja für alle möglichen anderen Abschlussarbeiten seines Fachs ebenso zur Verfügung stehen. Und wenn es nicht gegen die Regeln wäre, würde er es ja nicht anonym machen.

Es herrschen hier sowieso teilweise sehr komische Ansichten, naja, ist halt ein Coinforum, abfällige Bemerkungen dazu verkneife ich mir mal...

Wissenschaft = "Schaltstellen der Macht"? Also das ist auch witzig. Der Otto Normalwissenschaftler kämpft ums Überleben, arbeitet sich ab, arbeitet an seinen Versuchen, schreibt Anträge und Veröffentlichungen und liest wie ein Verrückter. Dass die getane Arbeit oder gefundene Lösungen tatsächlich mal den Weg in die Anwendung finden, ist nur zu einem kleinen Teil der Fall, das meiste bleibt bestenfalls im Informationsspeicher liegen. Entscheidung, also Macht, darüber hat ein normaler Wissenschaftler kaum. Er ist eher frustriert, dass einige Lösungen klar auf der Hand liegen, aber eben nicht angewendet werden. Darüber entscheiden Politiker, Gesetze und der Markt - welche vom Wähler und Kunden gewählt werden - welche von den Medien und Meinungsmachern beeinflusst werden. Machtstrukturen gibt es aber eben innerhalb der Universität oder Arbeitsgruppe. Da kann man mit seinem Professor Glück oder Pech haben und die Professorenwillkür kann recht weit gehen, wobei das zum Glück heutzutage auch teilweise geregelt ist bzw. sich durch den "Markt" selbst regelt, also gute Doktoranden möchten ja auch in faire Arbeitsgruppen gehen.

Ich bin auf curiosity's Seite.

Natürlich gibt es Missstände und Dinge die im Forschungssystem zu verbessern sind, aber das ist es ja gerade: Wenn man das Problem einfach nur kurzfristig und vorübergehend umschifft, indem man Andere für sich arbeiten lässt, löst man keine Probleme. Wenn man so eine Arbeit nicht schreiben kann, soll man dann überhaupt nur noch und in Zukunft Ghostwriter engagieren? Dann würden ja bald die reichsten Leute offiziell die "besten" und berühmtesten Wissenschaftler werden. Dürften halt nur kein Interview geben, weil man das dann auch noch nachsprechen lassen müsste oder vom Prompter ablesen...

Wie schon gesagt, ist es harter Fleiss, den auch die Mehrheit der normalen Studenten ordentlich durchläuft. Und diese werden von ein paar Schummlern verarscht.

In der Forschung ist es auch keine Sünde, zu kooperieren und die Arbeit aufzuteilen, so dass halt jeder das macht, was er besser kann und sich natürlich auch von den anderen helfen lassen kann. Nur sollen die Mitarbeiter eben auch genannt und bezahlt werden. Wenn der Originalposter hier so gut ist, dann ist es schade, dass die Wissenschaftswelt keinen richtigen Arbeitsplatz für ihn übrig hat. Auch Auftragsforschung kann er als Selbständiger gerne machen. Muss halt nur transparent sein. Natürlich können auch gewisse Arbeiten offiziell in Auftrag gegeben werden, alles kein Problem bei entsprechend offenen Karten.

Aber Dinge wie Doktorarbeiten u.ä. müssen nun mal selbstständig gemacht werden, und die verwendeten Mittel müssen angegeben werden. An einigen Unis kann man auch bereits veröffentlichte Arbeiten in die Doktorarbeit einbauen, wenn man Hauptautor ist.

Eine Straftat ist der Doktor-Betrug vielleicht nicht, aber ganz eindeutig ein Betrug. Wenn man dagegen ist, muss man halt Doktorarbeiten an sich abschaffen oder eben auf den Titel verzichten. Aber genau dieses Verzichten wollen die Leute ja dann plötzlich nicht. Stattdessen suchen sie nach Rechtfertigungen, wieso es okay sein soll, sich heimlich eine Arbeit zu kaufen.

Übrigens wünsche ich viel Unglück. Ist wirklich lächerlich, solche Agenturen als Abzocker zu bezeichnen, aber den eigenen Betrug bzw. die Komplizenschaft dazu dann womöglich als gerechte Sache anzusehen.

Legal ist es auch nicht, zumindest nicht, wenn man dann versichert, die Arbeit selbst geschrieben zu haben.

Niemand hat übrigens etwas gegen Zusammenarbeit und Anregung durch andere Arbeiten in der Wissenschaft, so soll sie ja sein. Aber auch transparent und ehrlich. Und fleissig.

Kann mal jemand ein paar solcher Agenturen nennen/verlinken?

If we would really put an effort, it should be possible to stop them, site is still working and getting new "customers"?

The company says it's British:

Registrant Name: GABRIEL KLEIMAN
Registrant Organization: BTC CLOUD SERVICES LTD
Registrant Street: 46-48 EAST SMITHFIELD
Registrant Street: TOWER BRIDGE BUSINESS CENTRE SUITE 313
Registrant City: LONDON
Registrant State/Province: LONDON
Registrant Postal Code: E1W 1AW
Registrant Country: GB
Registrant Phone: +44.1163262646

UK +44 116 326 COIN
US +1 (855) 782-COIN

We are incorporated in the United Kingdom

Name & Registered Office:
BTC CLOUD SERVICES LTD
46-48 EAST SMITHFIELD
TOWER BRIDGE BUSINESS CENTRE SUITE 313
LONDON
ENGLAND
E1W 1AW

Company No. 08935510
Status: Active
Date of Incorporation 12/03/2014
Country of Origin: United Kingdom
Company Type: Private Limited Company
Source: http://companieshouse.gov.uk/

So it would be good to find some people from London - then it might be easier to even inform the police there...

And collect the scammed users in this forum here.

Maybe we could also complain about the website:

https://whois.domaintools.com/bitcoincloudservices.com

Whois Record for BitCoinCloudServices.com
Email    abuse@enom.com
Registrar    ENOM, INC.

Hi,

bitcoincloudservices.com stopped my payouts last year (2015) after about 5 months of a one year contract. Definitely scam.

But they still accept new "customers".

Nobody there who wants to make them pay?

Hi,

bitcoincloudservices.com stopped my payouts last year (2015) after about 5 months of a one year contract. Definitely scam.

But they still accept new "customers".

Nobody there who wants to make them pay?

For me, ROI can also be seen as a time unit, maybe there is a correct word for it, too.

So: ROI could be 13 months, for example, meaning the time to reach break even (0 expenses, 0 profits).

Hi altsheets,

good idea to integrate a short information system into a software.

I haven't been here for a long time. Did you sell any of your software already now? It would mean that your asset is valuable for your shareholders. Note that it might be also egoistic to collect money and not generating profits at all. Well, okay, sorry, it is not egoistic but useless and maybe naive and unrealistic. Well, maybe that's the definition of idealism.

You should really charge money for your work but if nobody wants to buy, an asset is useless for shareholders.

Now please don't be insulted, I appreciate your efforts. (But I have completely sold your asset for my own 'egoistic" reasons. You should take into account that usually not all people here are rich - so it is not a question of egoism if you just can't give away your money for others. Unless your name is Jesus, maybe.)

Regarding information about assets, the real and best thing is to evaluate them and discuss them (uncensored), and the best place for something like this is a forum like this (unless you want to offer some kind of payed information service).

That's why I wrote a short "report" here:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1008110.msg11472629#msg11472629

But it seems there is not much feedback. I don't expect any income from this (as you do), but if it can help someone to not invest his money in a scammer or a useless asset, I'm content. Of course, some feedback or discussion would be interesting in this "why would I buy an asset" thread.

As I said somewhere before: For me, the cryptocurrency world from my point of view is divided into the scammers (I would call them egoists, too) and the naive people (idealists without working ideas and the easy-believing victims of the scammers).

And there is the little minority of people who really have working concepts (which includes money, it is not "evil" in itself, and all this here IS about money, that's why it's called a CURRENCY). These people are the hope.

Hi, I would like to participate, though I'm not sure I will always reach the minimum post count - I have some life outside of here, too...:

Name:    Hubus
Posts:    167
Activity:    126
Position:    Full Member
Bitcoin address:    1E5C8SzXQ7C15BAvdMQaQf6e2v8S1HSU9N

I have tried some assets for some time now (about two-three months) and will add some experiences/facts/opinions here (note that I calculated the dividends per year but have the assets only for some months, so changes might be possible):

NXT assets:

1) I bought the GlideSec asset, and it seemed to have extraordinary dividends (about 250 % per year compared to the price I paid for it) - and it was of course too good to be true, so I received this one and only dividend (for a week of course, not a year!) and then the whole thing was abandoned by the "developer" and turned out to be a scam.

2) Atomic asset: No income with dividends so far, no selling for a higher price possible so far. Maybe later?

3) Coinomat and Coinomat1: At least there is something going on and this project is not about empty promises. Personally, I get around 11-13 % (per year) dividends. But on the other hand, the price sank down much more, so I would not be able to sell it without a bigger loss.

4) Freemarket: Not much going on there so far. No dividends so far. Price declined so far. So: a loss so far.

5) Liquid: One of the best assets so far as the dividend for me personally (taking my buy price) is about 20 % p.a. AND the value of the asset increased.

6) Pangea: No dividends and a price loss for me, so far.

Horizon (HZ) assets:
(As mentioned earlier, all HZ assets currently have the problem that buying an asset means giving up the safe 10 % interest you get when you just store them in your account)

7) AAssetHZ: No dividends so far, asset is still new but never heard of any sales. Still, there seems to be some fantasy in it, as I bought early and could sell for a higher price which still seems stable but shows no movements at all in the last weeks.

8 ) HZxchange: The asset description promises weekly payouts, but no dividends and a price loss so far. But the project is still new and showed at least some progress in that it started.

9) HZChronos: No dividends planned. I could buy early enough and even though there are no results from the project so far, it is still young and I could sell for a higher price and win something. Buying price is still higher than issuing price.

BURST assets:

10) ByteBank: Quite good dividend around 24 % p.a., and the asset issuer placed a re-buy order near the issuing price. Good. But on the other hand, the value of BURST dropped.

11) BdeBank: Almost the same as ByteBank, but available at smaller units and no buy wall, so, a lower sell price.

12) ByteEnt: My best asset so far: Dividend about 30 % p.a. (in relation to my buy price, that would mean ROI in around three years) AND value increased slightly. Unfortunately, there is still this problem with the decreased BURST coin value which annihilates the profits.

The biggest income seems to be possible with buying an asset cheap (in most of the cases this is possible when you buy early, when the asset is new and just issued) and sell it at a high price. The funny thing about that is, that this might not require a long time nor a successful or trusted asset. On the contrary, "serious" assets might keep a "good" price over a longer time, but not necessarily extraordinary profits. I have watched some assets with (so far) reliable dividends of more than 20 % per year without causing a high attention of buyers and therefore with sometimes even declining prices. Instead, for a good buy/sale-return it is more important that you profit from the "hype", even if the asset never proved its functionality and is essentially bullshit or just sleeping for an indefinite time. So don't wait too long and try to sell it while there is some hype and fantasy in the minds of the buyers. Note that this is just my observation, I am not promoting this!

Some/many assets seem to be really just crowdfunding projects where the profits for investors may or may not come very much later. In my opinion, from the investor's point of view there is absolutely no reason to buy them fast and early unless you want to help this crowdfunding or unless you are so early that you can sell the asset soon for a better price again. But they are not worthy of buying and holding in the long term view as there will come later opportunities to buy them (again) when and if they (ever) start realizing their project goals.

One thing to be careful about is also the currency/coin-system where the asset is located: It's of no use if your asset pays e.g. 10 percent dividends and the price also rises to 110 percent, but the coin goes down 50 % at the same time. A realistic example, see above.

Looks like a ponzi. Maybe you can make some money if you are an early investor. Try it out and tell us if you got something back...

Thank you kaduwall for your efforts, your doing an important thing for the crypto world! As it is full of scam cases, someone (we?) should really find ways to combat this. Maybe someone knows about other similar threads here and can provide some links?

@adroitful:
Unless you can explain and prove your claims, we cannot really rely more on this than on the promises of the Glidesec Seller (won't call him developer) ActualUpsurge. Everyone can claim everything here, the proof is the problem. Before you claim, you can of course look for hints and possible traces. But we can't be sure like this.

Yes, it's just gambling with low risk. You can buy a lot for almost nothing. Then there might be a chance of 1:100000 that the dev returns and the buyers will make some profit when the price comes back. But probably these people are wrong and there is ZERO chance.

I am ready.

But how can you be sure who it is?

I don't understand the connection. And one thing is a big problem: Of course, a ponzi or a pump and dump scam can be a good investment. But for whom and for how long and at which cost? This is never productive work or a win-win situation, it's always a win at the cost of others. It's never a win for all.

In a lottery, it's the same - but in a lottery you know what you are dealing with. In a scam, you are lied at and deceived. You are the prey which is lured into the trap.

Well, I do understand Namrekka's question, because the following seems "a bit" contradictory:


and then:


Is this ironic? Sarcastic? Maybe you can explain instead of throwing insults.

And: No, I did not follow the whole story from the beginning and don't know who is guilty or not, so I cannot really judge, but I got some bad feeling here in my short time in cryptocurrency and this forum already.

Well, those greedy unfair liars are just parasites, feeding on others and leaving them bloodless. No need to look up at them, on the contrary.

I don't know about Bitrcy. But I just found "autodiv", which some people connect with the same person or pattern:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=926800.msg11232722#msg11232722