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The first line in that Bloomberg article sums up everything pretty nice, no need to read it all...
The same way you can buy gold and when the times comes you realize that you can't make even an engagement ring from the ten kilos of paper gold you have in your safe.
And a second paragraph made me really laugh:
That definitely convinced me to go all.....the way to the right corner and close that page
Who writes this stuff?
Quote
If you want to buy Bitcoin without actually buying Bitcoin
The same way you can buy gold and when the times comes you realize that you can't make even an engagement ring from the ten kilos of paper gold you have in your safe.
And a second paragraph made me really laugh:
Quote
Unlike exchange-traded funds, ETNs are debt instruments that are backed by their issuers -- often a bank -- rather than a pool of assets and often focus on esoteric strategies that dont easily fit in a fund.
That definitely convinced me to go all.....the way to the right corner and close that page
Who writes this stuff?
Esoteric!! Oh boy, I haven't had that good of a laugh at Bloomberg in a long time. Those fools are just writing fluff in hopes that some dumb fool feels the need to purchase their $5000 a month "news" platform.
ETN is exactly what the market does not need. That's just another step closer to a fractional reserve type currency where they just sell the air you breathe and call it an asset. Useless.
ETF's are a bit closer to the real thing, but if you want to invest in something, why don't you just buy the damned thing instead of paying your broker $30 a quarter and $10 a trade? Brokers are dinosaurs that are ready for mass extinction.
I don't follow your logic, but if you think adoption is a bad idea, then your best plan of action is to create your own coin and don't tell anyone else. That way, while everyone else suffers from the curse of adoption, you will still enjoy the benefits of a coin that can be used only by you.
Exactly, each of us should create their own coins, in secret, with a private chain and should not trade or sell of buy stuff with them at all.
The price is going to be whatever we want it to be so ...we're all going to be rich beyond our wildest dreams..in our dreams.
do you really think that the gouverment and banks would stands by and loose its control ,of course no they will find a way to centralize it in that case how would the world economic lool like ?
If bitcoin can be centralized than it has failed already.
Besides, the biggest bull run happened after Japan declared Bitcoin as a legal payment method.
Take that out and we might go back to 3000$ or 1000$. Is that what you want?
Yes of course, we can't hide it from everyone. That much is clear.
Adoption can cause a bit too much trouble at some point, however. Widespread adoption isn't necessarily good because these companies might try to do something fishy, like offering "cash-backs" or "credits" that stretch bitcoin further than the supply available.
Centralization of bitcoin is impossible like you said, which is what makes it truly robust. It's also what makes governments nervous about it.
No they will not be hacked. The only way anyone can get your funds in these wallets is if you make a mistake with your security. The algorithms that are used to secure these wallets are unbelievably secure.
that's false dude.we heard many news that many exchange walllet hacked.and also cryptocurrency wallet too.few days ago many people claims that their balance in myetherwallet stolen.Ok buddy but there's a big difference between an online exchange and a crypto wallet. If you keep your own wallet in Electrum, Core, etc. like the OP said, you cannot possibly be hacked unless you are careless with your security. Exchanges, on the other hand, are quite susceptible to hacks because a lot of them don't practice good security. They might have 2FA, sure, but that's not a guarantee. There's always a back door in which is why there needs to be fraud prevention specialists on duty 24/7 at major payment systems like PayPal and banks. I highly doubt that these exchanges are paying to have competent fraud prevention specialists sitting and protecting their exchanges 24/7.
Tax is indeed one of the thing which the country rely on. The government is doing the right thing when establishing taxing procedure. The society should be part of the success of a country, not only their government.
Together, they build projects and systems which make benefits for them.
For me, the problem is not about the implementation of taxing procedure in a certain country. It is the corrupt leaders and elites who are toxic enough to drag down the country. I therefore conclude that we should not focus on the regulation about taxing, we need first to fix the system in the government.
Taxation is really beneficial, it depends on the government officials if it is toxic or not.
Together, they build projects and systems which make benefits for them.
For me, the problem is not about the implementation of taxing procedure in a certain country. It is the corrupt leaders and elites who are toxic enough to drag down the country. I therefore conclude that we should not focus on the regulation about taxing, we need first to fix the system in the government.
Taxation is really beneficial, it depends on the government officials if it is toxic or not.
It's true, you can see the societies where taxes are actually effective, like Scandinavian nations, the people there are quite willing to pay taxes and follow rules. Their governments are quite transparent, so the people can trust them and feel that their money is being put to good use.
But in countries where there is clear corruption everywhere, the people try their best to find ways around the system. They do everything they can for short term gain because they feel like their being screwed by their governments. Unfortunately, this is the case for most countries nowadays.
don't wait for lower price, there is a very strong support at ~$6,000
if you are planning to add more bitcoin to your portfolio, you should buy now
even if it drops below $6k, I'm sure it will bounce back within a month
if you are planning to add more bitcoin to your portfolio, you should buy now
even if it drops below $6k, I'm sure it will bounce back within a month
There are too many people holding stakes in bitcoin at the $6k level so it cannot go below there. The cost of mining becomes unprofitable so it would almost be worthless if it went below. There is a lot of money invested in the mining so people will buy at low levels to preserve their long term investment prospects.
I don't understand why some people are expecting it to go lower. It's already dropped a third of its value from the peak last winter, and there's only good things to come. So this is just another opportunity to get on for a lower price. Take advantage of it.
China may have an economic crisis. The trade war between China and the United States has seriously affected China's economic development!
In China, Internet finance has collapsed, many middle-class assets have been misappropriated, and Chinas high housing prices have a big bubble! The Chinese government has issued legal tenders to cause inflation!
If it is serious problem, then both countries need soft conversation and solve the problems. Because both countries are very powerful by financially and both countries have very powerful respect in all over the world. In China, Internet finance has collapsed, many middle-class assets have been misappropriated, and Chinas high housing prices have a big bubble! The Chinese government has issued legal tenders to cause inflation!
And not to mention the Yuan is collapsing underneath all of the tension. I've been short China almost since Trump was elected. Those two are going nowhere together.
Yes, of course they should have a reasonable conversation. They seem to think that antagonism is a better idea though and are choosing to make things worse by sending threats and comparing cocks. But we cannot argue that it was, once again, USA who started it. And it will be, once again, China who will be blamed.
Re: The only way that governments will successfully compete with Bitcoin
Most people are fine with using things like credit cards, bank autopayments, bank-linked payment apps, etc. They're easy enough, and since the payments are reversible, they're highly forgiving of the average person's absolutely abominable security practices. These people are not going to switch to either Bitcoin or FedCoin any time soon, and they can be ignored for now.
I wish more people realized that, it seems like most bitcoiners actually believe that in the next years everyone and their grandma will stop using banks and switch to Bitcoin. A lot of people will get so disappointed in 5-10 years that there's no "mass" adoption. They like to compare Bitcoin with Internet, electricity and other inventions to somehow make an argument that Bitcoin will have the same adoption curve, which is completely wrong because Bitcoin's innovation is very different from those examples.
Yeah I agree. A lot of crypto users have their heads up in the clouds when it comes to the the real life application of the currency. It's easy to dream of it achieving word domination in the realm of finance, but the real question is how?
Bitcoin needs many more features to be inherent in it to be usable, namely those mentioned above. It has great potential, but we need actualization for it to work. It doesn't just flood through and then everyone magically makes the shift over to crypto. There has to be a good reason for it, and a strong enough guarantee to make people feel safe. Try asking someone to pay you in bitcoin, and watch the look on his/her face. The majority aren't ready to trust it yet.
That could be possible when op's idea becomes reality. When there is any government issued currency people automatically trusts it.
It's human nature to trust an authority. We need some form of foundation to surround us so we can see that what we are doing is stable and safe. A lot of people on this forum would probably admit that they were a little bit hesitant about bitcoin when they first heard about it, and if they had known what they do now, they would have gotten on it earlier. But you can almost never make a sound judgement with the limited amount of knowledge that is in front of you at the moment.
So the decentralized nature of bitcoin is its Achilles Heel in a way because it appears as a vulnerability for those who don't want to put their money in something that is not backed up by a government.
The half of your funds buy some potential altcoin then the other half take it as a capital for your day trading. I think that is the best way on how for you to have more bitcoin. By diversifying your asset it can make you more secure than putting your asset on a single coin or investment.
I agree, and clearly you're good at picking the right coins so you should take advantage of that. Don't risk too much on any single offering, but continue selecting the coins that you think are the best.
You can also start drawing up plans for one of your own. That will take a lot more time and effort than it seems, so you might want to keep going with the altcoins while you get things in order. That way you can balance yourself between the income that you know you can get, and the income that you will earn with a big project in the future.
Humans have a natural desire to find causes for everything that happens around them when sometimes those causes are not easily discovered. This is why sports commentators will always have a good reason for you about the performance about your favorite team. They want to make you feel comfortable and say "ahh, ok" instead of sitting there in wonder and frustration. It's the same with markets. Watch headlines do complete 180 degree switches from "this caused that" to "that caused this" after the market hits a price rejection point. Markets bounce. End of story.
I am glad that I don't have to hedge anything since a large chunk of my wealth is parked in Bitcoin already. I do hold a relatively small amount of gold as well, but I am not planning to add more in the coming years, unless the gold price tanks deep, but that's highly unlikely. In other words, I'm good. In most cases people will only act when it's too late already, which makes me feel sorry for them, but on the other hand it's their ignorance and unjustified trust in the regular economy making them lose out. We have been through so many economical difficulties, that people should have had a wake up call years ago already....
A true legend of bitcoin. I will not hold much wealth in bitcoin compared to gold. Probably balancing them is much better. 50:50. But I guess you know what bitcoin has done for you that is why you prefer to hold your wealth in bitcoin. Currently, the price of bitcoin is dwindling, and I can imagine the amount you are losing now. Recently, my friend lost 93 bitcoins because his hard drive crushed.
Me too. I wouldn't put it all in one basket because these things can happen. Bitcoin is also vulnerable to loss, technology can be unreliable at times, there can be failures, etc. It's also hard to wait for Bitcoin to reach spending levels again sometimes so it helps to have something else that can be sold if needed. I always look to see what made the most profit if I need to sell something, and I circulate things that have made a healthy profit. I'd also keep some fiat in stocks, bonds, or other things as well, just because it is still commonly used. Sure, it may not be something we like to use, but it's the way society functions... for now.
Establishment commentators tend to blame every financial crisis on the "bad luck" of a whole host of factors coming together to create a "perfect storm." What they "forget" is that the incentives of the modern system always drive the elites themselves to destabilize their own system. Not sometimes. Not most of the time. Always.
They will say that the 2007-8 crisis was a combination of the US banking deregulation of the 90s, the US political agenda of moving poor people into home ownership, the poor financial oversight by the George W. Bush administration, the 'global savings glut,' the existence of a shadow banking system in the US, the loose monetary policy in the aftermath of the dot com bust, etc. etc. All true. What they forget to mention is that, if it were not these factors, there would be others (stock buybacks anyone?) If it hadn't happened in 2007-8, it would have been later.
They will say that the 2007-8 crisis was a combination of the US banking deregulation of the 90s, the US political agenda of moving poor people into home ownership, the poor financial oversight by the George W. Bush administration, the 'global savings glut,' the existence of a shadow banking system in the US, the loose monetary policy in the aftermath of the dot com bust, etc. etc. All true. What they forget to mention is that, if it were not these factors, there would be others (stock buybacks anyone?) If it hadn't happened in 2007-8, it would have been later.
I'm convinced that buybacks will be the reason behind the next crisis. They're pumping themselves full of air and it will eventually collapse when the massive overvaluation of companies cannot keep up with the sales or whatever they profit from. Just look at what happened with Facebook last week when they got hit with the cold reality that no one likes their shitty algo-driven newsfeed anymore and have started flocking elsewhere. One by one these giants are going to take mighty blows, and the fabricated value will come rushing out of the balloons they call their companies.
The reason why these elites destabilize their own systems is because they're so far away from the results of their actions they don't realize it until it's too late. The cushion is too big.
Taxation is theft. "But who will build the roads" argument is really old and dumb, people are not some stupid monkeys who can't figure out things if no one guides them, there's nothing that can not be done privately and through voluntary cooperation (which is the same as privately). Roads, military, science and so on - all of it can and is done privately around the world. Government is exactly why Bitcoin was invented - you can't trust people with power and believe that they will do as they've promised, and even well-meaning leaders do stupid mistakes that cost billions. Just like Bitcoin have decentralized economy, some day people will decentralize power to the point when every individual will be independent from others.
Organization of the people! That's not as hard as we think it is. When there's a huge need for something, people get together and help each other. Taxation is theft, and is more so in some countries than others. When multiple ministers of a particular country in the middle east got caught with shoe boxes full of money buried under their lawns, the peasants said "They work hard, they deserve it". Ignorance.
In my own country, the tax is defined as a tax that is a particular measure by which the state uses its power to communicate the private sector to the public sector for its socio-economic functions. governments. From a taxpayer perspective, taxes are defined as the number of compulsory contributions that every organization or individual has to pay to the state in accordance with the law in order to meet the need for expenditures for the performance of functions and duties. of the state, taxpayers can legally enjoy the remaining income.
This is called the progressive taxation and you are taxed according to the rise in your income. Besides, this is something that the state has to rely on if the economy is not in a very good shape. It actually shrinks the gap between rich and poor of a country and has been a good portion of the GDP of almost all the countries except Dubai where it accounts to only one percent of the total GDP. In countries like Norway, taxation contributes up to 30% to the GDP. This is the reason why the living standards have been so high in countries like these.
Dubai's an example of how rich will always rule from their almighty position because they have such high standards to enter their level of living. They continue to separate themselves by widening the gap so they will always be untouchable up there.
I saw Russian thread about waves and I saw there are the same questions. There are 2 options - first of all usually waves team or someone involved to waves team buy some tokens. They usually supports their token. of course this is not official, but people who looks like insiders wrote about that. The second one - there are one huge seller. Nobody knows who is this, but looks like this is someone from older investors or something and of course all market was red, so this is multiple effect.
Yeah this is usually what makes a selling spree much worse. Things are already a bit red on the altcoins market as it is, and then if there's a massive move it sets off an avalanche. Waves looked like it had pretty good support around the 2.50-3 region and I was even thinking about getting in there. But now it's plunged down there's no telling where it will go.
It will slow down though, so nothing to worry about. But it might not come back up to a good level for a few more months after such a large drop, unless some big investors get into it. They would need to have a very good reason to do this.
Banks will take up anything that they can charge commission on. It wouldn't come as a surprise if there are banks accepting crypto, but I would be cautious about fees. P2P networks tend to be much cheaper. You might even get a better price from your online exchange.
The problem is the countries where regulation prevents banks from using it, like what happened in India recently. Also China, Venezuela, Turkey... there are many countries where the government will step in and try to block the transactions if they somehow think they are losing out on tax
The problem is the countries where regulation prevents banks from using it, like what happened in India recently. Also China, Venezuela, Turkey... there are many countries where the government will step in and try to block the transactions if they somehow think they are losing out on tax
First, we have to remember that Waves price in June 2016 was $ 0.7 per unit, and it is now above $5 per unit. Which means that this increment was of +600% in one year. Waves is a "long term investment" cryptocurrency.
Waves will enable people to make custom tokens and create their own cryptocurrencies (without coding) and then launch their own ICO to fund their projects. This is great and very interesting.
For these reasons, I think waves will be a big tradable value in the future.
Waves will enable people to make custom tokens and create their own cryptocurrencies (without coding) and then launch their own ICO to fund their projects. This is great and very interesting.
For these reasons, I think waves will be a big tradable value in the future.
This is a good reason to invest in Waves. If it is something that other people will want to use to do their own work, then it is a logical investment. As long as it is reliable and safe.
Most successful businesses follow a similar model. If they provide something that enables people to be successful and do great things, people want to support them. That's what the future of altcoins it: the ones that are actually contributing useful content to society will be very very valuable.
The best time to buy altcoin is now.
I see the market condition is experiencing price increases and began to improve it sign the market will go up and Cryptocurrency prices will stabilize again.
By buying now you will have the opportunity to earn more profits if Cryptocurrency prices rise.
I think you should take this good opportunity to buy Altcoin.
I see the market condition is experiencing price increases and began to improve it sign the market will go up and Cryptocurrency prices will stabilize again.
By buying now you will have the opportunity to earn more profits if Cryptocurrency prices rise.
I think you should take this good opportunity to buy Altcoin.
I second that. It's ridiculously low right now, and usually that's the best time to buy. I would be putting money in when it drops, and waiting patiently. Sometimes it keeps going down further, don't worry. That's just how it reacts. But you can see that it's not moving down so quickly anymore, so it will eventually find a good solid bottom and then wait for reversal. If things don't go your way immediately, don't panic. That's where sometimes trading can be difficult--the patience involved in waiting
⭐ Merited by LoyceV (1)
Excellent post! This is a very valid argument for the merits of bitcoin and the value it has in terms of usage.
It's great that buying bitcoin is becoming more accessible. That also means that it is becoming more easily monitored, however. Easier access for you means easier access for them. So if it's something that you're trying to avoid being noticed for, extra precautions need to be taken of course.
The thing that amazes me about bitcoin now is that you can literally walk into a shop with cash in hand to purchase it. Or you can meet a fellow from localbitcoins who will take your cash and send you coins. It's about as anonymous as it gets. Or is it? Could these people be working for the tax authorities?
It's great that buying bitcoin is becoming more accessible. That also means that it is becoming more easily monitored, however. Easier access for you means easier access for them. So if it's something that you're trying to avoid being noticed for, extra precautions need to be taken of course.
The thing that amazes me about bitcoin now is that you can literally walk into a shop with cash in hand to purchase it. Or you can meet a fellow from localbitcoins who will take your cash and send you coins. It's about as anonymous as it gets. Or is it? Could these people be working for the tax authorities?
Re: The only way that governments will successfully compete with Bitcoin
Most people are fine with using things like credit cards, bank autopayments, bank-linked payment apps, etc. They're easy enough, and since the payments are reversible, they're highly forgiving of the average person's absolutely abominable security practices. These people are not going to switch to either Bitcoin or FedCoin any time soon, and they can be ignored for now.
I wish more people realized that, it seems like most bitcoiners actually believe that in the next years everyone and their grandma will stop using banks and switch to Bitcoin. A lot of people will get so disappointed in 5-10 years that there's no "mass" adoption. They like to compare Bitcoin with Internet, electricity and other inventions to somehow make an argument that Bitcoin will have the same adoption curve, which is completely wrong because Bitcoin's innovation is very different from those examples.
Yeah I agree. A lot of crypto users have their heads up in the clouds when it comes to the the real life application of the currency. It's easy to dream of it achieving word domination in the realm of finance, but the real question is how?
Bitcoin needs many more features to be inherent in it to be usable, namely those mentioned above. It has great potential, but we need actualization for it to work. It doesn't just flood through and then everyone magically makes the shift over to crypto. There has to be a good reason for it, and a strong enough guarantee to make people feel safe. Try asking someone to pay you in bitcoin, and watch the look on his/her face. The majority aren't ready to trust it yet.
Yeah, it's so sad that people are taking advantage of other people's gullibility and ripping them off. A friend of mine lost a lot of money in an ICO that he didn't do his due diligence on. Even if you research it fully, how can you ever know if it is legit? There's not a lot of validation around now in terms of security. We need a way of actually being able to protect ourselves, like collateral on a loan. There's a reason why banks ask you to declare your assets. They want to be able to come and take them if you don't pay up. Maybe we should have a similar process for ICO's? That way they can put their money where their mouths are.
The problem is, most times the amount of money going into these things is much higher than the net worth of the people behind it.
The problem is, most times the amount of money going into these things is much higher than the net worth of the people behind it.
Re: The only way that governments will successfully compete with Bitcoin
This is a great thread. You know, they have a great potential with that kind of anonymous payment system to centralize everything and keep it all under lock and key, so what's stopping them? I think that they have this in mind and are already slowly moving towards it (Sweden is something like 98% cashless now) just by getting people used to the fact that they don't need physical currency anymore. Then what? Slip them across from the Swedish Krona to the e-Krona, and just change the terms slightly. Many more countries will begin to follow suit. And I don't think it will necessarily be fully anonymous, in fact, they might even sell the information to the highest bidding market research firm.