hmm not much people responding

Why, please explain. How will that happen?

Hi


Some questions:

1 So how many tokens are created in total? Which part is still hold by Sirin LabS? 60%? Is there a guarantee no more token will be issued in the future?

2 How, Why would token price increase with time? I don´t get it. Even if no more tokens are issued, it doesn´t make sense. For example if your phone is worth 999 USD. Ans Sirin Tokens are worth X. Then you need 999USD / X Tokens. So I just buy the token and instantly buy the phone... It could be 100 Tokens or 3 Token, at the end the phone costs 999USD for me.

I understand Sirin Labs collects funds with ICO, but I don´t see the benefit for Token buyers ...

Can someone enlighten me please?


 

Great  This nightmare is only getting worse. The part about Tokens being a security, and Giga-Watt breaking the law with possible actions by SEC is very interesting. 

They are being sued! Good luck Giga-Watt and especially Dave Carlson, if they weren´t so incompetent, it could have been on of the best ICOs out there


People still waiting on Batch1 mners! 7 Months after payment. They still not even half way on their timeline... Tokens not getting rented out.

Only one positive note, they update their dashboard for users, so now it´s not extremely crappy and useless.

   

Wow, just checking in on this project I would never invest in (read previous post of mine)... I was right, ICO is over, and no one from Envion here to answer questions, just some payed shills.

In a few months people going to wake up and see that the MMU is just a stupid idea...

Sorry guys, learn by doing. Still many good crypto project out there

In the best scenario, when more miners are deployed so at least in one month

In the worst scenario, never

I have tokens for a month now, always rented out between 60-65%. And this is not going to change for the next few months.

Update on the dramatic and failing Giga-Watt:

Miner deployments STILL being delayed, people STILL waiting for more than 3 Months for their miners. Still ZERO communication on what is causing this delays. In the meantime Dave Carlson has sent a bullish*t email praising the future of Giga-Watt, no mention of when people are actually going to get what they paid for...


The truth? As we are left in the dark by this conman, we can only guess.  Many theories have arrised because of their lack of communication and incompetent email support. Have tons of emails with lies as proof.
The first theory, was always on the table, is that they were using our miners to earn crypto for themselves, this exaggerated theory would mean they are just plain criminals. I hope they are not.

Second theory, IMO very plausible: They are not getting the power they need from Washington State, and in worst case they have to pay more for power in the future (you know who will have to pay for that), or even get shut down on the long run. This shortage of power is causing the delays. Yes, Dave Carlson is so incompetent that he not only never managed to work out the issue with permits (PSU´s) before raising millions of dollars from investors, but he also totally miscalculated the importance of a healthy relationship not only with customers but also the government

Dark clouds hanging over Giga-Watt... Anyone is free to debunk this theories. And for the trolls out there, yes ICOs are risky, I know, in the first place any loss, is my own fault.

The whitepaper is not a contract so technically they didn't brake a contract. Miners are going online every month after long delays to great joy of customers. But it still doesn't change anything about the fact that they sold miners with false deployment dates knowing very well they can't keep their promise. They deceived a lot of people and caused months of lost mining revenue. And after this huge screw ups they first blamed on inspections even now they can't deliver things on time. They are screw ups. Additionally they have suddenly two new buildings George and Epfrata to host miners, not pods just normal buildings of which non were mentioned in white paper or in their correspondence. They did this I guess only to avoid even more delays. Most customers had 3 months delay

That is not the point, I think you don't get it actually. Surely they are real, the main point is


The idea of putting 90 ASIC miners in a container and claiming with 25% reinvestment budget they can compete with large industrial mining farms, in a time difficulty goes up while new miners come every few months, and promising 160% profit in the first year, is RIDICULOUS. They clearly don't understand how the mining industry works. Bitmain D3 and L3+ miners for example barely make profit. Imagine them putting this miners in their MMU. Just do the math! But nice for you that you met this real people! Just don't count on that 160% in first year. I dare you, please invest and let me know in one year how you fared lol

Hi right mesh

I can do the Dutch and German translation. Secondly I have an idea for your project. Unfortunately I can't program myself but what if you would have an App that warns people about natural disasters, terror attacks or even power or internet outages...
Kind regards

I don't also understand how this coin is trippled without any real news coming out. The fact it is only traded on a few exchanges makes me assume it is a pump and sadly dump. I tried their wallets andI must say, not so great... I really don't get the hype. Maybe FOMO and whales

so you just get 100 000 IOTA coins after 500 minutes?

This was also one of my points... I expect as answer: "Yes we have calculated this in our business model, we have some big experts here. Read the whitepaper .. The answers are on Telegram" but in reality they give no real answers.

@envion

I can't wait for your fully automated container miners. But until you have them ready, I also want to take these classes for training powerplant personel who are going to maintain your MMU! Really I will even pay for it!

Thanks for your reply! A+ for the effort. F for the content. No real answers as expected. Where are the test results of your MMUs in 40 degree Celcius outside temperature ?
When are you going to give this "evidence " of big bank investing that caused you professionals to delay the ICO date?
How long was your estimate on profitable lifetime of your 96 ASIC miners that you gonna put in your >100000$ containers?

@Investors
I know German the article in Bitcoin-echo.de is written by someone who admits getting in crypto in 2017. no further experience. Contrary to this probably paid German article is the opinion of more experienced hacked.com https://www.hacked.com/ico-analysis-envion/amp/

The CEO says in the German article they want to have up to 1000 MMU to decentralize mining, that's like 10.0000 ASICS.., 😂😭😭 that's so ridiculous. I cant believe people are buying this nonsense. Bitmain releases that number of miners like in a month (of course they don't publish this numbers. Estimates by others online.) These people obviously Just want to get in crypto and collect easy money. This forum is also being flooded by paid puppets. I ask All of the normal users who use this forum to give their honest opinion

Sorry for the poor english guys. I corrected some mistakes but I guess there are still some in there. English is not my native language

@Envion

Thanks for replying my questions. I found your project interesting at first sight, hell I was willing to invest! But then I read the article in Hacked, and now I see, it was 100% on the spot!  https://hacked.com/continue-reading/

But as we have freedom on the net, and this forum is legendary for spreading info, (as many people invested their valuable time to improve our world with blockchain), you have tempted me to a response. Please do not forget YOU are the one here selling something, I am not. I am giving my opinion to investors. Here goes :

Dear Envion,
 
Firstly please stop lying. I haven´t insulted anyone on your Telegram, your people there just blocked me because I dared to ask questions. Exact same thing happened to guy from Hacked. You accused him of insults too.

If you accuse me of something be sure to deliver proof. I dare you! I have this chats on Telegram stored, don´t make me post it here. Again I did not insult anyone, your people on Telegram are arrogant, as are you, and not able to go in discussion. All they keep reapeting is, and I will put it in simple words:
 
"read the white paper, everything is in there. We are professionals, we know what we do, stop asking stupid questions. Trust us, give us our money."  

It is fine to explain to noobs  on Telegram how they can transfer their money to you, but I want answers to my questions.
__
POSTPONING
Postponing was a no-brainer. We're looking at deals that could rival the size of our ICO and bring greater returns to every token holder.  Nobody who manages to get a token on the 15th is going to second-guess that decision.

--> no real content here. So one day before the ICO should begin, you have new deals, but no info on what deal. We should just trust you and wait for it. Will do! Very curious. I think you didn't´t get enough fishes.
___
BANK INFO
We'll give evidence of the cooperation in the coming days even if we can't give the bank name.  This is big news for us and a top priority.

--> again no content. So we will never know which bank it is. We will just have to trust you. I will be waiting for your evidence.
__
TEMPERATURE EXTREMES
Our MMUs work at VERY low temp with outside temperatures in a normal range.  Our testing shows that it will work in 40C. Also, if we need to retrofit a container for a special installation location, then we'll do that.

--> I will repeat my question form previous two posts. Where are these test? Where are these results? in you white paper you have fancy sketches and pictures. Why can´t we see these tests? This is the deal breaker for me. I want the data, show it if you are legit!
__
Right now we have the luxury of choice of where in the world we install. These edge cases are a non-issue to profitability. For some reason, people think the company can't make money because there exist places in the world where X occurs.  We just won't take those deals if we can't figure out a way to make money. There are plenty of offers where we can do just fine.

---> So let me quote your white paper in case you forgot:

"...This process has gone even further. In India, Chile and the Middle East, PV plants get paid as little as $0.03 to $0.04 Cents (USD) per kWh generated, which is only a slightly more than the price of dirty coal power..." and

" ... Once built, they are tied to their location and might lose competitiveness to other locations if price structures change. While new market conditions might be lethal for traditional data centers, they offer vast opportunities for the global,  exible and intelligent mining operation that envion is launching now..."

So I read: in India, Chile, Middle East and also California, there is cheap electricity for now, and your MMU will be moved to location where this cheaper power is available so to this hot countries. And you are saying "we just won´t take deals if we can figure out". What is it now? Have you or have you not figured it out? It reads in the white paper as, you have figured everything out, and you´re willing to move your MMUs to places like this. Why use this places like an example if you re not gonna move MMUs there.  Now you are saying "people think the company....". Yes I think, I am people.
___
HEATING
Our operating unit is currently inside a factory providing winter heat.  

--> Do you have a big demand on heaters for factories? Do you have deals? Can you provide more info on that?
__
MAINTENANCE
Anyone can put GPUs in a box and call it a mining unit.  Our innovation is that we use the same processes that industry uses to design for maintenance, for production lines, and for remote operation.  If you are comparing envion to random miners operating in a random corner of the world and not enterprises like Bosch or Samsung, then you don't grasp how we operate.

---> Yes, correct. I don´t grasp how you operate. That is exactly why I have asked you this questions. Furthermore just so you know, there are already many multibillion industrial mining farms around the world. I know this because I have seen them with my own eyes or footage of them. From your company I have seen two youtube videos of a container with holes in it and two small fans on the sides...
___
The MMUs are designed to be as low maintenance as possible.  Even thought they are close to zero maintenance, our first customers will host large arrays of dozens of MMUs—places where it will be cost effective to have maintenance personnel on duty or where power plant personnel can be trained to perform routine activities.  

--> This is my favourite part of your reply.
So your answer to my question, where the engineer or IT guys will be, inside the container or sitting outside somewhere, or traveling. Your answer is, power plant personal will be trained? lol
And I also like the part where you have customers who will put miners in dozens of MMUs. One MMU fits about 90 ASICS so >1000 ASICS will come your way. Do you have a timeline when this dozens of MMUs are going to be released? Do you already have such customers who have over 1000 ASIC ready to put in a container?
____
Eventually, we will engineer all of the remaining manual maintenance activities out of the design and it will be possible to install a single unit somewhere where maintenance personnel is not available.  Again, for now we have the luxury of choice and all the calculations for this are in the ROI details we've published.

--> I can not believe my eyes! So you are telling, you are going to monitor (realistic), control (realistic) and maintain (NOT realistic) over 90 miners from a distance? But until you get there "eventually" you will have the power plant guys do it? Hmmm good very satisfying response.
____
HARDWARE REPLACEMENT
Our calculations include regular hardware replacements due to bad miners or occasional burn out.  More importantly, our mining software makes those replacements much less likely.  

--> This is maybe the biggest invention and news. So you have software which will compensate for inferior hardware? So if GMO manages to make 7nm chips and miners come out. You have 100 000 USD ready for replacement ? Or is your software going to compensate?
____
When the hardware is no longer able to mine profitably, then we use it for something else. Large enterprises as well as startups are investing billions into blockchain technologies and the computational power from these miners can be used to provide the physical infrastructure these businesses rely on.  The cost of the container itself is marginal compared to the GPU/ASIC price.  When they are completely obsolete and cannot provide any more value, the entire unit will simply be replaced.  That's part of what the 25% reinvestment is about—growth and deprecated MMU replacement.  That is all part of the ROI calculations.

--> Yes throw some more "billions and millions" I guess the greedy noobs really like that. 25% will cover the cost of 100 000USD new mining hardware you will need every year for each MMU? You probably have heard of technological singularity ? Yes Blockchain is big business now already and everyone wants a piece. If you are in crypto for several years and have witnessed the parabolic growth, not just of price of crypto, but advances in mining hardware. Then you will get my point, your MMUs with a price tag of 100 000 are too expensive! I expect hardware updates will be needed at least once a year. This means the cost of a MMU will be double of what you expect it to. So all your calculation and 25% is not going to make it.

My Conclusion:
This is all my personal opinion.  Everyone is free to invest in what they want. Everyone is free to their opinion. This is why this kind of forum exists. If you do not want people asking questions or being critical, then you do not know the mindset of the core supporters of crypto. Then just ran adds on google as click bate.

For people new in crypto, watch out, do your own thinking and invest only that what you can afford loosing.
I do not think Envion is a scam. The idea of mobile mining solutions sounds nice. But the question is, when there are already big mining facilities function and offer   0.03 or 0.04USD power cost and offer maintenance of miners, offer professional engineers working on the project. People who mined before some of this guys of Envion even knew what Bitcoin was. Why take the risk with Envion? For me this guys do not bring real answers, they are common salesman. Just repeating sentences with no reals content, trying to get a piece of the cake.  I rather by coins and HODL!  
P.S. Examples of failed ICOs on mining:
https://affinitymining.io
https://mineum.org
https://bitcoinexchangeguide.com/tothemoon/
Good luck everyone!

lol

so not true. There are mining farms with access to cheap hydropowerplant in which you can invest ALL over the WORLD (USA, Austria, Iceland, Eastern Europe, Thaland ...)

just google it

Thank you, but what you told is all in the white paper. The question is how is this gonna work, when the outside temperature is warm??

Are this MMU gonna be only near cheap electricity sources where it is cool? So what is the point of this mobility?

@ Envion

I appreciate your replies but I still have questions. Always looking for good investment, but I am still not convinced. Just wanna say that I am blocked to on your Telegram, your people there are very impolite, they do not answer my question and kicked me out. I was very friendly, but I guess you have something to hide.

I do not think your company is a scam, but I am convinced you are in over your head. I expect delays and broken promises. Maybe in one year your company will be interesting to invest in...

Postponing an ICO is a very bad sign in my opinion... Serious business keeps its deadlines.

That is very nice that you have a ´big bank´investing in crypto, good for you. Would be nice to know which bank! Especially when we in the crypto world know how banks are big fans of cryptocurrency.

Secondly still no answer on where your metal boxes with hot miners will be stationed. Are you planning on putting some next to solar power plant some where with a lot of sun? Where it is hot and not 26 °C, the temperature you mention in WP. Before you say, read the white paper, I have. You talk about using the heat for other purposes but how about performance in hot and humid area´s. Do you have any test done? Where are the results?

WP says: ´Converting our MMU’s waste heat into a system where thermal energy is useful provides savings which are directly proportional to the amount of electrical energy being converted by the MMU. Heating expenses, before and after installation of a MMU inside a heated warehouse or greenhouse, can thus be easily assessed and the savings on heating the building can be directly deducted from the MMU’s electricity bill. This creates another unique competitive advantage for the envion MMU over conventional mining farms, which are typically installed in remote areas and thus unable to recycle their massive amounts of thermal energy.´

So you gonna put the MMU inside buildings? Who is gonna pay for that?


Secondly, are you putting people, engineers in the containers for maintaining the facility? WP says ´There are fully automated systems in place which detect defective rigs, based on IP address and rig denotations, so that any maintenance worker is able to locate defective hardware within a very limited amount of time.´

So if you have ANY mining experience you should know that a person on the ground is mandatory. All your WP says, you have fancy sensors, but who is going to fix the miners that are broken? Where are your engineers located? Who is paying them?

Last, your WP claims you can fit up to 96 ASIC miners in one MMU( container), so what is going to happen when this miners are outdated? In the current situation it is very likely that every 6  to 9 months new companies will come with more efficient miners. So if a miner would cost 1000$ (very optimistic projection) you will have to spend 96 000 $ to update your MMU. Who is paying that?

Why all the secrecy, just spill it out...