Its list of features is super strong to see

will this contribute to responsible fair trade practices?

Have you ever thought about buying BFL Monarch?

My Thoughts, Product not even ready or released, think about this...

http://www.butterflylabs.com/monarch/
$2196.00 Monarch 5-16-2014

How much can you really make?

every 11-12 days difficulty increases and look at the history at the bottom and at the top you cal plug in hash rate
https://bitcoinwisdom.com/bitcoin/difficulty

$14.96 / day 600 GH processing power @ $438 per coin.

Every difficulty increase take away 10-20% right now... and assume no power cost your NOTHING assume 15% difficulty.
at $15 a day for 12 days then it will be 12.75 then  $10.83 etc. and these figures assume that no one else gets their card and only you have it...

That is about $440 for the 1st month and your really not going to get it for a while.
What really will happens wen the onsloght of Monarchs etc come to market along with all the other manufacturers...

Just thinking here... its got to be a stupid investment

One that I have made with BFL 50 GH units, I am only at about $2500 of my $8k investment and it will never come back. and this folks is since january 14, economics looked great, looked like 2 months to pay off but difficulty kept increasing and btc price kept going down.

Now the really big question... What will happen when there really is no entry level, when people cannot use their CPU's or GPU's and all that equipment is now wasted, at least if you had GPU's you can sell em to gamers with BFL equipment, now what?

When I eat power bills at $10 a day to fund 50 GH units and 2) 10 GH units, it is to the point right now where they are going offline for me this sunday. Go look 440 GH only makes me me $10 a day right now, so what is the point.

So really what happens when the general public cannot mine and make BTC? Will popularity drop off? I personally think BTC is over, it had a lot of interest form people when CPU and then GPU mining everyone could be involved for as little as $200 now I fear to play the game it is beyond the cost of the average person.

TIme to dump your BTC while you still can. I am even reading now here the big HASH farms that sell by GH cant even break even.

What are you going to do?

George

Actually the US govt has figured it can stay in business stimulating the economy with QE and other measures. The problem, let me put it in a small story.

Say you have a corporation call it the USA Corp and they issue 1 trillion shares of stock and in fact make all shares bearer shares. Then distribute these shares to people who actually do work or trade items for these shares.

Let us say 1 share = $1 get the picture your dollar bill is really a receipt for a "dollar" that does not have any basis in reality. (it used to be based on gold and or silver at a fixed unit to $ value ie $35 $ to one ounce of gold.

With QE and such the govt simply prints more shares in the company and they spend them into existence buying things like stocks and overpriced toilet seats for NASA. let us say the QE is 10 billion a month at the end of the year they have stimulated the economy with 100 billion or 1/10th of all shares in existence.

The govt did not produce a product or manufacture anything they simply printed more shares of the corporation and sold them and they got the profit. While at the same time there is now 1.1 trillion $$$ in existence.

So say you had 1 dollar bill or share in the corporation  and your share represented 1/trillionth well now your 1 dollar in your pocket was just devaluated to 1 of 1.1 trillion you just lost 10% of your value they robbed you and yours for 10% of your savings.

So each month the govt prints more shares and injects them into the market, ie keeping stock prices high for the rich f***s .

In reality if you were a private company and you wanted to issue more shares you would have to do a stock split and compensate all other stock holders a equal percentage of all stock issued. ie in the scenario above they would have to issue you 10 cents in addl stock for free bringing your shares to 1.1 up form one. otherwise it would be THEFT.

Why do we let the country get away with this fraudulent practice?

The Dollar was indexed to something of value until 1965 when they took the silver out of the coins. Right now silver dime from 1964 in crappy condition just the silver value is $1.45 http://www.coinflation.com/ look near botton of page for older coins, this is the actual melt value of the metal in coins. So I ask you did the silver in a dime gain weight or has the government debased the currency over 14x using this as an example.

This is THEFT without a gun. The pen can steal much more than the sword in the long run and this is the game our politicians play, give the image we are a great country but make it on th ebacks of the little people by stealing anything they save through devaluation and printing money. you cannot print somehting of value and get away with it...

Next you get the finances of Zimbabwe of the 1990's an germany post WWI id a wheel barrel full of money to buy a loaf of bread.

And for others Hyperinflation is not 10-20% a year. it is 10-20% a day, people ask bosses for pay daily as by the end of e the week thier paycheck cannot keep up with the cost of food!

Stock up on beans and rice now... its coming this summer or next winter...

George

He said she said, it is in my opinion these devices are computers, they have a ASIC processor that runs x GHZ and uses the usb cable to get data. Where a periphial to me is more like a xbox controller. but we will see, I made a written complaint and it has to be follower up in writing. I will post the answer here one way or another. so lets see what happens.

I dont think self declaration will work with these, I have offered to send them a couple one 10 GH and one 50 GH for their evaluation.

As far as I know a class A computing device it cant be marketed to hobbyist or consumers only to business and they have to implement policies not to sell to individuals.

They do not list a suite number on their website only when you get a RMA #101
I cant find a listing for Butterfly labs on the state corporations website in KS Im fIling complaint w/ state atty general on monday, i did find one that said BF labs at a different address and as far as I understand they cant advertise under a different name than their corporate registration.

Lets see where all this goes...

You cant delete your own chat stuff there so, an admin must have done it?... makes you think hummmm...

Local BBB  Better Business Breau has given BF Labs Butterfly Labs ButterflyLabs a "F" rating

http://www.bbb.org/kansas-city/business-reviews/electronic-equipment-and-supplies-wholesale-and-manufacturers/bf-labs-inc-in-overland-park-ks-1000002011

Basically response on the site was its up to you to check your customs importation requirements... sorry...
Heck we need to check with local USA FCC rules...

Look at their discussion forums while you still can they are having problems getting products into the EU apparently.

https://forums.butterflylabs.com/pre-sales-questions/7374-miner-found-noncompliant-eu-law%3B-bfl-ignores-all-contact-attempts-2-months.html

and maybe soon under a stop order from the USA FCC

Warning be careful if you purchase ButterflyLabs BFL hardware
They hav enot answered me with their approval number I have filed a complaint with the FCC and possibly getting a class action going against them.
There is a discussion going on at

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=430525.0

Gosh this is getting interesting...

I wonder if the postal authorities would be concerned about possible illegal goods being shipped through the US mails?

And I wonder about the FBI for the interstate commerce trafficking in possibly illegal hardware.



Many calls and WRITTEN complaints to be made.

I heard somewhere that BFL is making 75,000 of the monarchs I dont know if true or not, I hope this does not stand in their way as I told Jim Szeliga to get on it quick or a bunch of i think illegal products could or may hit the market

Red Wolf
I saw you were on BFL chatbox when someone posted a link to here this topic and then it was amazingly gone...
Can you testify to seeing something appear about FCC and link to here then it being quickly deleted by moderators?

Also I cannot find a listing with the Kansas Department of Corporations for them either and they claim to be incorporated on their website

Perhaps you can find a listing...

https://www.kansas.gov/bess/flow/main?execution=e2s1


I think it is against corporate law to not have a filing in the name you do business as , as well as listing your correct address on the form. Again I dont know but I am digging into it.

Anyone who still has an account at BFL forums, they have deleted mine rather than answer my questions and they are editing their troll box and forum postings!

Please go there and get people to come here to this forum, give them a link in the troll box

Forgot to mention
when submitting your complaint, after initial submission but before sending there is a place to attach PDF copies of your invoices, scan and attach your invoices as well so they can see it is not just me lets flood them with complaints and get a quick enforcement action!

You will get a conformation number after everything is submitted!

Inquiry Tracking Number:   275835
Date of Original Submission:   01/30/2014
Date of Submission:   01/30/2014

George

Here is the officail complaint
You can file your own at
https://apps.fcc.gov/oetcf/kdb/index.cfm
on left click on "submit an inquiry"
then after filling your information select complaint
then non compliant equipment

This is the Federal Government folks, each and every complaint HAS to be followed up on!

--
 

I spoke with Jim Szeliga re: Butterfly Labs www.butterflylabs.com
He said to file a complaint and to ask it get routed to him if needed to speed things up since he is up to speed a bit.

The company has terrible customer service which has lead me to start digging looking for problems with the company I was reading
http://transition.fcc.gov/Bureaus/Engineering_Technology/Documents/bulletins/oet62/oet62rev.pdf

and my intrepration of a external periphial computing device requires some form of written authorization and the company will not provide it and deleted me access to their discussion forums.

Butterfly Labs
has been marketing / selling these products for nearly 2 years
they told me they do not need any FCC approval

They are selling a essentially a math co processor for a computer that is a external periphial running at over 9mhz their devices plug into a computer and do complex math problems, they market and sell online to residential customers and have been for some time.

I have spent over $8,000.00 with them and want my money back. Many others have been affected, there are thousands of customers and they are coming out with a new product as well a internal card to process computations as well.

Please look into their 10 Giga Hash and 50 GH products those are the ones I bought and I'd be happy to submit a device for quick enforcement action.

Please look at their website to confirm marketing to anyone and offering equipment for sale without any FCC approvals or authorizations. Also I believe one of the main people in the corporation is an ex felon if that makes any difference.

Contact info follows, they have NEVER returned my phone calls!

http://www.butterflylabs.com/

Their address is

Butterfly Labs
10770 El Monte #101
Leawood, KS 6621
800-809-6463

PS I could not find any corporation listed at that address or name by the
Kansas Business Entity Search
https[Suspicious link removed]cution=e1s2
the only thing that comes up is BF Labs at a different address. it looks like I need to address that as well with the Kansas dept of corporations, that will be my next complaint.

Good News Folks...

For those that knuckled under over BFL saying this has been beat to death... The problem is many people knuckle under when someone talks with w/supposed authority and do not follow through...

I just got off the phone with the FCC's technical standards division

Jim Szeliga
301-362-3051

He stated the BFL USB connected devices are PERIPHIALS under FCC law and require "Equipment Authorization" PERIOD no ifs ands or buts That the device until authorized cannot be marketed or sold to anyone in the USA.

WE are referring the case over to the FCC enforcement division today

Class action is 1 step closer....

Anyone want to join me now? I am now interviewing law firms to see who will be best for this case.

Call Jim and ask... They need to get their phone blown up on this. Let him know how much you spent and that you want your money back as well.

George

I bought "in stock items" and i believe it took them over 2 weeks to ship them "from in stock"
then I have 1 powersupply bad right out of the box... took over a week for that to come in
I had another RA for a 50 GH unit only working 1/2 speed, took them 5 days after I filed a RMA request form my control panel, then I have to mail back, wait how long for them to fix and return? we will see, then shipping again, im looking at 3 weeks... and in this business time is money.
now I have another 50 unit running under 90% another unit that has to go back and I cant create a RMA while the other is still pending.
They do not answer their phone or answer emails with any clarity or even if answered at all.

Poor way to run a company... so of course I want my money back, today if possible, and he can have all their crap
if they want to go to court, cool, I'll keep mining until the date.

My whole point if they would ship as advertised from IN STOCK, if they would answer their phone form upset customers?
I have a 3 out of 10 device failure, that is so not acceptable. IN STOCK to me meand ready to ship, not have to process orders for a week, then have your device built. of course different things mean different things to different people.

They run a crappy company, and they deserve what they get, the FCC may not actually do anything that is why I am asking for a class action suit of others that have been treated like I have. The LAW is the LAW and I would not have gotten uppity if I was treated like a valuable customer.

Perhaps then they will treat customers correctly after they are sued and or shut down. it should be fun to subponea their customer list

I've heard rumors the company is run by a former felon...

So lets see what happens.... f them

I am I supposed to know these units are not FCC certified?
Read the link above, I have a call into the FCC and they are looking into it.

Either it is legal to sell or not...

Can you sell computing devices without a FCC sticker in the USA?
or a periphial that has a clock rate over 9MZ

If BFL would be prompt with customer service perhaps they would not have gotten this drama, the point is, if it is legal or not.
If illegal then all transactions are null and void.

The FCC regulates this stuff to protect you and I form invisible microwave type radiation emitting form the device.

You ld you want a microwave in your house that was not certified?

Im sure you would, go take the door off and jumper the safety disconnect and see what happens to you after a few months of constant use

George