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Re: [ANN] Slimcoin : Proof of Burn NEW BLOCK GEN, Mineable by low power computer!
I've started a thread in the Slimcoin subreddit about the economic implications of Proof-of-burn, particularly price stability. Everyone is invited to share his/her opinion 
http://www.reddit.com/r/slimcoin/comments/2bl751/can_proof_of_burn_lead_to_longterm_price_stability/
http://www.reddit.com/r/slimcoin/comments/2bl751/can_proof_of_burn_lead_to_longterm_price_stability/
Slimcoin is not a POB only coin. In addition in slimcoin; POB is dependent of POW that makes Slimcoin definitively not a reference for the Proof-of-burn concept.
Re: [ANN] Slimcoin : Proof of Burn NEW BLOCK GEN, Mineable by low power computer!
I am burning coins but no resoults. How may coins are you burning? How many coins you gain and how often?
Just uses your stats 101
chance is aproximately totalcoin burned / total coin you have burned
Re: [ANN] Slimcoin : Proof of Burn NEW BLOCK GEN, Mineable by low power computer!
They have not changed yet, I still have not pushed the updates.
Somehow my client isn't finding any PoB anymore past 30 hours, maybe there is something changed?
I normally find between 3 and 6 PoB every 24 hours.
2200 SLIM burned..
SetBestChain: new best=00000001540ac72c5c32 height=36278 trust=15616798614 moneysupply=376804.070875 nEffectiveBurnCoins=166191.691281
ProcessBlock: ACCEPTED
SlimCoinAfterBurner():
Smallest Hash is 00000017e6fe0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000001
by tx 358e280c7076522ee09a2aa26644bccd0e84173460bd80050fd58f5a1bb0ffee
with Block height 33666, transaction depth 1, vout depth 0
PoB Tartget is 000000014acb0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
nBurnBits=1d014acb, nEffectiveBurnCoins=166191691281 (formatted 166191.691281)
I have got 1 with aprox the same amount of burnt coins
Re: [ANN] Slimcoin : Proof of Burn NEW BLOCK GEN, Mineable by low power computer!
Could I have more feedback regarding having a switch to enable/disable PoS minting on the client. See my long post 1 page back for details.
Better would be a button on the client instead of a startup parameter, but i don't have issues with PoS because i burn all.. don't ask me
Same for me...
Should have button in addition, not instead because when you run wallet headless it could be difficult in this case to deactivate POS...
Re: [ANN] Slimcoin : Proof of Burn NEW BLOCK GEN, Mineable by low power computer!
Could I have more feedback regarding having a switch to enable/disable PoS minting on the client. See my long post 1 page back for details.
Better would be a button on the client instead of a startup parameter, but i don't have issues with PoS because i burn all.. don't ask me
Same for me...
Re: [ANN] Slimcoin : Proof of Burn NEW BLOCK GEN, Mineable by low power computer!
I just finished implementing the bigger updates for PoB and PoS, etc.
I still want to test the changes, so I will not release them yet.
Here are the changes:
PoB difficulty is now target based and targets to be found 1 every 3 PoW blocks.
PoS difficulty base was increased to that of Novacoins'.
PoS reward was increase to 10% to compensate for the increased difficulty and make it worth minting (because with 1%, the reward is dust)
PoW, PoB, PoS block "trust" values were adapted to that of Novacoins'.
Previously, PoW and PoB blocks had a trust value of only 1 while PoS trust values were much larger. Now, all block types have a better calculated trust value.
Client starts up much faster. That was possible by modifing the blkindex.dat file structure. That means that when you update, you will have to delete the blkindex.dat and blk0001.dat files and re-download the entire block chain again.
More rpc commands added: getrawtransaction, getpeerinfo, listburnminted.
I have not yet fixed the PoS 100% CPU usage that some may have experienced. It seems to be an issue in the basis of PoS and not Slimcoin's additions. What I could do to "patch" this issue is disable PoS minting from startup and make the user add an option like -enable-pos-minting (or something) to make the client do PoS minting. The benefits of that are that staked coins will accumulate age and then, manually, the user could restart the client with that option. Since the coins have aged a lot, they will find the PoS blocks quickly, and then the user could restart the wallet w/o that option again. I want to reiterate that the main idea and innovation of Slimcoin was Proof of Burn. Proof of Stake should be considered an optional/extra part of Slimcoin.
One way that PoS issue can be resolved is by sending one big transaction with all of your coins to yourself, another address you own. That will destroy all of the coin age of those coins, but that will not take up any CPU since (as can be read from some posts above), the client will only have to split one tx into two and not hundreds of small txs into even smaller ones.
Small Note: The changes listed above to Pow, PoB, PoS will take place after a specific timestamp, so updating the wallet will be required within a certain time frame.
I still want to test the changes, so I will not release them yet.
Here are the changes:
PoB difficulty is now target based and targets to be found 1 every 3 PoW blocks.
PoS difficulty base was increased to that of Novacoins'.
PoS reward was increase to 10% to compensate for the increased difficulty and make it worth minting (because with 1%, the reward is dust)
PoW, PoB, PoS block "trust" values were adapted to that of Novacoins'.
Previously, PoW and PoB blocks had a trust value of only 1 while PoS trust values were much larger. Now, all block types have a better calculated trust value.
Client starts up much faster. That was possible by modifing the blkindex.dat file structure. That means that when you update, you will have to delete the blkindex.dat and blk0001.dat files and re-download the entire block chain again.
More rpc commands added: getrawtransaction, getpeerinfo, listburnminted.
I have not yet fixed the PoS 100% CPU usage that some may have experienced. It seems to be an issue in the basis of PoS and not Slimcoin's additions. What I could do to "patch" this issue is disable PoS minting from startup and make the user add an option like -enable-pos-minting (or something) to make the client do PoS minting. The benefits of that are that staked coins will accumulate age and then, manually, the user could restart the client with that option. Since the coins have aged a lot, they will find the PoS blocks quickly, and then the user could restart the wallet w/o that option again. I want to reiterate that the main idea and innovation of Slimcoin was Proof of Burn. Proof of Stake should be considered an optional/extra part of Slimcoin.
One way that PoS issue can be resolved is by sending one big transaction with all of your coins to yourself, another address you own. That will destroy all of the coin age of those coins, but that will not take up any CPU since (as can be read from some posts above), the client will only have to split one tx into two and not hundreds of small txs into even smaller ones.
Small Note: The changes listed above to Pow, PoB, PoS will take place after a specific timestamp, so updating the wallet will be required within a certain time frame.
That's a good one I think, I vote for the option to enable/disable POS!!!!
Re: [ANN] Slimcoin : Proof of Burn NEW BLOCK GEN, Mineable by low power computer!
Slimcoin,
Have you any idea about the time/ressource it takes to turn one loop in
Cwallet::CreateCoinStake
( because when POS is active, it is run by almost any coins in the wallet until fKernelFound and if you have many coins it could have a significant impact )
Have you any idea about the time/ressource it takes to turn one loop in
Cwallet::CreateCoinStake
( because when POS is active, it is run by almost any coins in the wallet until fKernelFound and if you have many coins it could have a significant impact )
Re: [ANN] Slimcoin : Proof of Burn NEW BLOCK GEN, Mineable by low power computer!
Yes, that is it.
But in that process, when does that happen?
Does it only happen when the coins are old enough, which is after the 1 week wait time, or when the coins can create a valid PoS block.
But in that process, when does that happen?
Does it only happen when the coins are old enough, which is after the 1 week wait time, or when the coins can create a valid PoS block.
I had a look into the code:
The process is launch every block but the calculation and split is done after 1 week of coin age.
The perf problem should be into the election test as it tests every coins, it multiply the delay and load.
Now it is to find out were and why because it has to be really quick .......
Re: [ANN] Slimcoin : Proof of Burn NEW BLOCK GEN, Mineable by low power computer!
...or just make it scarce enough! Higher difficulty + PoS after 3 months would fix it... Would also give us 3 more months to think about a new fix...
It does not fix the problem of quantity of transaction into wallets..... I mean dust coins
CPU itilization problem is triggered when there are hundreds of small PoS transactions. That wont happen if you increase PoS diff.
I think it is not only small POS transaction but also POW dust received from pools. I have that kind of dust into my wallet, I am sure you have as well (may be bigger dust
).My pool dust is not causing any cpu spikes whatsoever. I only had spikes when my wallet was minting PoS blocks. The second i encrypted the wallet cpu spikes dissapeared. I fixed the problem by moving all coins to a new wallet.
I think the CPU load is dependent of the quantity of transaction into the wallet whatever it comes (POS POB or POW) and it is generated by the POS process.
Re: [ANN] Slimcoin : Proof of Burn NEW BLOCK GEN, Mineable by low power computer!
...or just make it scarce enough! Higher difficulty + PoS after 3 months would fix it... Would also give us 3 more months to think about a new fix...
It does not fix the problem of quantity of transaction into wallets..... I mean dust coins
CPU itilization problem is triggered when there are hundreds of small PoS transactions. That wont happen if you increase PoS diff.
I think it is not only small POS transaction but also POW dust received from pools. I have that kind of dust into my wallet, I am sure you have as well (may be bigger dust
).IE: my wallet actually uses CPU and I have no coins into except burned coin and lot of POW dust from pool.........
Re: [ANN] Slimcoin : Proof of Burn NEW BLOCK GEN, Mineable by low power computer!
...or just make it scarce enough! Higher difficulty + PoS after 3 months would fix it... Would also give us 3 more months to think about a new fix...
It does not fix the problem of quantity of transaction into wallets..... I mean dust coins
Re: [ANN] Slimcoin : Proof of Burn NEW BLOCK GEN, Mineable by low power computer!
If this is part of the PoS and cannot be changed/has not been yet fixed, I could make it so that PoS does not start automatically, but require an option like -start-pos, or something.
A fix could also be to not split the transaction after calculation, something like:
Verify if the coin is old enough ( 1 Week ? )
then calculates the interest total= coins + interest
then create the new transaction with total and then remove the old coins.
Because the quantity of transaction is not only linked to POS but also POW can generates lot of dust coins, it could be also interesting to have a tool to concatenate coins automatically.
For example POS could be used as a regulator like,
if the coins value > high_limit then split coin
else if coins value < low_limit then if (next coin exist) concatenate coin with the next coin
Re: [ANN] Slimcoin : Proof of Burn NEW BLOCK GEN, Mineable by low power computer!
Yes, that is it.
But in that process, when does that happen?
Does it only happen when the coins are old enough, which is after the 1 week wait time, or when the coins can create a valid PoS block.
But in that process, when does that happen?
Does it only happen when the coins are old enough, which is after the 1 week wait time, or when the coins can create a valid PoS block.
I think when the wallet detect a valid POS block it launch this process ....
The problem is not the quantity here it is the separation of the old transaction into two new transactions. It works on paper but not in real time.
It was I think originally conceived to improve flow on the blockchain with a small amount of open wallet.....
Re: [ANN] Slimcoin : Proof of Burn NEW BLOCK GEN, Mineable by low power computer!
So there is no fix for this yet.
I do not understand what you mean by this.
Quote
The second is the POS calculation of interest multiply the quantity of transaction into the wallet because the processes separate in two part the old transaction creating two new transactions and so on every loop (increasing by 2^n the number of transaction by the time). Also if you connect to the precedent point ......
I do not understand what you mean by this.
I have not looked to the SLIM code but in POS code generally the process to calculates interest is:
if the coin is old enough
then take the transaction and calculates the interest
then take the total of the transaction + interest and
then create two new transaction with the half of the total (creating two new transaction)
then delete the old transaction.
This is the general process for POS, I think it is the same for SLIM, isn't it ?
So if SLIM uses the same schema, the number of transaction into wallet have a tendency to increase by 2^n and the performance dropping in parallel.
Re: [ANN] Slimcoin : Proof of Burn NEW BLOCK GEN, Mineable by low power computer!
I have decided not to fork since it is said a LOT easier than done.
I still need some information as to the PoS using CPU. Someone said that blackcoin's worked, I could take a look. What would really help would be some information when it happens. Is it durring the creation of the stake, or afterwards? This is not a bug that I programmed, it probably was around when I forked Slimcoin from Peercoin. If someone knows how it was fixed, please tell.
I still need some information as to the PoS using CPU. Someone said that blackcoin's worked, I could take a look. What would really help would be some information when it happens. Is it durring the creation of the stake, or afterwards? This is not a bug that I programmed, it probably was around when I forked Slimcoin from Peercoin. If someone knows how it was fixed, please tell.
In blackcoin the POS process is not implemented the same way. In some other coin I know, the POS problems exist as well an I do not think they are fixed yet.
As I known first, the performance problem come from the multiplicity of the transaction into the wallet. More you have transaction more it takes CPU for POS......
The second is the POS calculation of interest multiply the quantity of transaction into the wallet because the processes separate in two part the old transaction creating two new transactions and so on every loop (increasing by 2^n the number of transaction by the time). Also if you connect to the precedent point ......
I had this problem on another coin: I have let my wallet open for POS for weeks and by the time I had 40000 transactions and my CPU has jump to the ceiling at 100%
Re: [ANN] Slimcoin : Proof of Burn NEW BLOCK GEN, Mineable by low power computer!
For me in the POS process 2 major fix to increase the viability of slim (as other POS coin) :
Performance: POS should not take any power from computer or a very low part.
Multiplicity: POS should not increase the number of transactions. After calculation of the interest, the base + interest should be in a new unique transaction and the old one to be deleted. I think if you address that part It could helps a lot for the precedent part.
If you manage to fix these two issues you will be really close to success (at least technically)
Performance: POS should not take any power from computer or a very low part.
Multiplicity: POS should not increase the number of transactions. After calculation of the interest, the base + interest should be in a new unique transaction and the old one to be deleted. I think if you address that part It could helps a lot for the precedent part.
If you manage to fix these two issues you will be really close to success (at least technically)
Re: [ANN] Slimcoin : Proof of Burn NEW BLOCK GEN, Mineable by low power computer!
Another idea that would be better long term wise:
I could take novacoin's source code, and add the Dcrypt and PoB aspects to it.
That is not a small job since there are a lot of differences. It will probably not be a 1 week project.
It is better for the long run of Slimcoin as all the commands and bugs that were in peercoin are added/fixed.
The new client will be made backwards compatible with this blockchain, so you will not lose any coins at all.
I could take novacoin's source code, and add the Dcrypt and PoB aspects to it.
That is not a small job since there are a lot of differences. It will probably not be a 1 week project.
It is better for the long run of Slimcoin as all the commands and bugs that were in peercoin are added/fixed.
The new client will be made backwards compatible with this blockchain, so you will not lose any coins at all.
Great!!! Very good idea!! At least if you want to keep PoS.. if you choose not to keep PoS fork from bitcoin
Why not Blackcoin instead of novacoin, Blackcoin has a more active dev team on the source code?
PS: Please split up dcrypt and PoB into seperate classes and files for that matter, and made them accessable by methods and functions
I do not know for novacoin, but blackcoin POS works nicely it could be an inspiration.