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Board Electrum
Re: Cannot restore my BTC wallet with a seed frase.
by
nodc3
on 08/08/2025, 06:38:09 UTC
I've used BTCRecover to check all combinations of my passwords (4 most probable +10 least probable), and 400+ most probable derivation paths (2 of them are most probable, 2 less probable and 4 slightly probable) .
No success.
I will bruteforce short passphrases with lower cases only up to 6 or 7 letters, but the chance of success is close to 0.
I guess its time to say goodbye to my bitcoins. It was a huge sum of money for me, but I still got like 30% of my money left, that will let me live my life comfortably in the next couple years. But I'll have to continue my career and stop playing videogames that much Smiley
Thx to everyone who tried to understand my problem and help.

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Topic
Board Electrum
Re: Cannot restore my BTC wallet with a seed frase.
by
nodc3
on 07/08/2025, 10:35:28 UTC
I'm currently struggling to understand how to bruteforce my possible passphrases. Simply adding them to tokenlist and changing --mnemonic-length to 13 didn't work.
Too man fuzzy variables are a pain in the ass.

What if I want to find my derivation path this way with a known passphrase? How do I add it to the script? Since I don't really want to bruteforce it at this moment, rather than try 10 of my most commonly used passwords.
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Topic
Board Electrum
Re: Cannot restore my BTC wallet with a seed frase.
by
nodc3
on 05/08/2025, 13:44:33 UTC

If I put something stupid in derivation path like m/39'/0'/0', it doesn't find it, even if I add this derivation path to ./btcrecover-master/derivationpath-lists/Electrum.txt.
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Topic
Board Electrum
Re: Cannot restore my BTC wallet with a seed frase.
by
nodc3
on 05/08/2025, 11:18:03 UTC

Huge! I was giving up deep down inside after trying all slightly realistic combinations of derivation path and a passphrase. Thank you, that's what I need.
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Topic
Board Electrum
Re: Cannot restore my BTC wallet with a seed frase.
by
nodc3
on 03/08/2025, 17:10:34 UTC
I created a seed phrase using electrum, it was in electrum format.
Let's assume this is now confirmed and that you don't have a spelling error in your Electrum recovery words used with BIP39 option in Electrum. Can we assume it confirmed too that you didn't alter the sequence of the Electrum recovery words?

Yes, no doubt.
Today I came to some more logical conclusions about my actions that day. I did ctrl+c, ctrl+v of m/44'/0'/0'/0/0 to derivation path. Then I clicked to IanColeman page https://iancoleman.io/bip39/. Checked that derivation path for BIP44 is m/44'/0'/0'/0. And since they contradicted with each other by one index, I decided that less is better, and that is when my flashback about deleting smth from derivation path actually happened. Then I thought since Electrum originally had even less zero's and I have no idea what corresponds to external and internal, I most likely decided to leave only m/44'/0'/0'. Then when restoring the wallet I was just changing h to ', and that was my second flashback. So most probably I just had to change 8 to 4, and h to ' x2.
So
60% chance derivation path was m/44'/0'/0'
35% chance derivation path was m/44'/0'/0'/0
5% chance it was smth stupid like m/44'/0'/x', m/44'/0'/x'/y, m/44'/0'/x/y, where max for x is 1, max for y is 3.
Since I tried all these variations it leaves me with only one conclusion. I most likely had an extension word in my seed phrase.
It couldn't be smth I use constantly, since I didn't even document that.
Will spend my evening bruteforcing in that direction.
Post
Topic
Board Electrum
Re: Cannot restore my BTC wallet with a seed frase.
by
nodc3
on 03/08/2025, 08:28:39 UTC
Is the arrangement of the words in your written backup correct?
It is, no doubt.

~~~
Although not 100% reliably confirmed, it seems so far OP created an Electrum seed, but switched to BIP39 option to mess around with derivation path. We don't know for sure, if none of the recovery words or their sequence have been messed with. Anyway, this will very likely give a BIP39 checksum error but we know that Electrum allows to proceed even with such a checksum error.

OP says he has paper and metal backups of recovery words. I would assume any alterations (or none) of recovery words would've been done before making a metal backup.

Of course there's the possibility that OP altered the recovery words in some way as a means of obfuscation and backed up the obfuscated words (which is foolish and a recipe for desaster when not additionally properly documented elsewhere).

I'm almost running out of crazy ideas what could've been done wrong.  Tongue

Frankly, I don't know if FinderOuter can cope with such crazy things that might have happened in this case. (Haven't had to use that tool yet.)

My conclusion to this moment is:
I created a seed phrase using electrum, it was in electrum format. But I wanted smth that can be restored without electrum. So I just used it as a Bip39 seed phrase, and it worked, even with a "Bip39 checksum failed".
Meanwhile I was reading articles about restoring a btc wallet only using a seed phrase. I found out I should use m/44'/0'/0'/0/0 for bitcoin. I also have a new flashback, that I deleted some of the indexes in the end with a thought "I don't know wtf is that, lets see if it works without it. (Thats a new detail I remembered yesterday before sleep). Also I remember replacing "h" with '.
It worked, I got a working wallet and was able to restore it after deleting. I printed seed phrase, learned it by heart. Then moved a large sum there. Then deleted and restored the wallet again. It worked, I was happy.
Thats pretty much it. If I'm right, the derivation path should not be too complicated, since I deleted some indexes out of it.
Here is the list of derivation paths I tried:
Quote
m/84'/0'/0'
m/84'/0'/1'
m/84'/0'/2'
m/84'/0'/3'
m/84'/0'/4'
m/84'/0'/5'
m/49/0/0
m/47'/0'/0'
m/44'/60'/0'
m/44'/0'/1'/0/0
m/44'/0'/2'/0/0
m/44'/0'/3'/0/0
m/44'/0'/4'/0/0
m/44'/0'/5'/0/0
m/44'/0'
m/44'/0
m/44'/0'/0
m/44'/0'/0'
m/44'/0'/1'/1
m/44'/0/0
m/44'/0'/1'
m/44'/0'/2'
m/44'/0'/3'
m/44'/0'/4'
m/44'/0'/5'
m/44'/0'/0'/1
m/44'/0'/0'/2
m/44'/0'/0'/3
m/44'/0'/0'/4
m/44'/0'/0'/5
m/44'/0'/0'/1/1
m/44'/0'/0'/2/2
m/44'/0'/0'/3/3
m/44'/0'/0'/4/4
m/44'/0'/0'/5/5
m/44'/0'/0'/0/1
m/44'/0'/0'/0/2
m/44'/0'/0'/0/3
m/44'/0'/0'/0/4
m/44'/0'/0'/0/5
m/44'/0/0/0
m/44'/0/0/0/0
m/44'/0'/0'/0/0
m/44'/0'/1'
m/44'/0'/2'
m/44'/0'/3'
m/44'/0'/4'
m/44'/0'/5'
m/44'
m/84'/0'
m/84'/0
m/84'/0'/0
m/49'/0'
m/49'/0'/0'
m/49'/0'/0
m/49'/0'/0'/0
m/44'/0'/1'/0
m/44'/0'/2'/0
m/44'/0'/3'/0
m/44'/0'/4'/0
m/44'/0'/5'/0
m/44'/0'/1/0
m/44'/0'/2/0
m/44'/0'/3/0
m/44'/0'/1
m/44'/0'/2
m/44'/0'/3
m/44'/1
m/44'/2
m/44'/3
m/44'/0'/0'/1/0
m/44'/0'/0'/2/0
m/44'/0'/0'/3/0
m/44/0
m/44/0'
m/84'/0'/0'/0

The list lacks structure, I'm currently trying to contact BTCRecover dev to buy a script, that could automate that.

I also tried m/44'/0'/0'/0           m/44'/0'/0'/0/0       m/44'/0'/0'    m/44'/0/0        m/44'/0'     m/44'/0    m/44'/0'/0  with everything I could use as an extended word for seed phrase, just in case.

I have a flashback where I was changing h to ‘ next to number 44. So most probably the beginning is m/44’/
And I remember it had more than one ‘.
I would highly recommend to properly document anything that you might remember so that you're able to thoroughly explore and exhaust any detail in your search methodically.
Yeah, I did it this morning.

OP, you have a messy spelling with certain terms, especially with the word "phrase".

If BIP39 option is ticked and you have a spelling error in any of the recovery words, making that word not be in the BIP39 wordlist, Electrum will display "Unknown BIP39 wordlist" below the entry box and next to the "Options" button! But also in such a case, you can still proceed in Electrum to the next step. Watch carefully what is displayed next to "Options" button. You don't want to introduce more variables than necessary.
English is not my native language, I rarely speak it now, and even more rarely write in it. I'm also actively learning Spanish and phrase in Spanish is "frase". Regarding spelling in the seed phrase, all the words there were familiar, and Electrum shows hints, finishing your word. And also at that moment all I was caring about is to not mess the seed frase, thus missing out on everything else.
Post
Topic
Board Electrum
Re: Cannot restore my BTC wallet with a seed frase.
by
nodc3
on 02/08/2025, 18:24:25 UTC
Quote
You were quite successful with that, likely not as intended by you, because "noone" includes yourself!
Haha, yes!
I’ve found out h is equal to ‘ in derivation path empirically.
I have a flashback where I was changing h to ‘ next to number 44. So most probablythe beginning is m/44’/
And I remember it had more than one ‘.
It seems that you almost did all possible ways to restore your original wallet.
And you also tried to recover the deleted wallet file on the MacBook, but you didn't mention what tool you used?
Would you mind telling us what tool you used to recover the wallet file?

I'd like to suggest you try Disk Drill to scan the whole drive, and let's see if it could find "default_wallet."

If it doesn't work, then your last hope is to know what you did to your seed phrase before making any copy.
I am thinking maybe you did scramble a few phrase? Or maybe you change the last part of your seed phrase?

If yes then try to brute force it using The finderOuter check the link below

- https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5214021.0
I was using Disk Drill, even did all the complicated stuff with lowering my disk security for deep scan.
No clouds, backups, nothing.
Pfrase is right Im sure.
Just to confirm you are seeing a green orb in the bottom right of the electrum window? What version of electrum are you using?


Yes.
I feel like I did a good progress today in remembering some details today. Also did a lot of structured brute forcing by hands.Will continue tomorrow. And thx everyone for trying to help, means a lot now.
Post
Topic
Board Electrum
Re: Cannot restore my BTC wallet with a seed frase.
by
nodc3
on 02/08/2025, 13:38:45 UTC
I've found an article on the forum that I was reading, when I was creating a wallet. Thats a huge leap forward.
It was stated there, that second index in derivation path for Bitcoin is (m/44'/0'/0'/0/0), and for Ethereum is 60 (m/44'/60'/0'/0/0).
I believed it was a common knowledge and changed it to 44, I'm pretty sure.
That still doesn't give me my wallet adress, I guess I changed smth in other indexes too. But much less to bruteforce now.
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Board Beginners & Help
Topic OP
MOVED: Cannot restore my BTC wallet with a seed frase.
by
nodc3
on 02/08/2025, 13:08:05 UTC
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Topic
Board Beginners & Help
Re: Cannot restore my BTC wallet with a seed frase.
by
nodc3
on 02/08/2025, 12:43:54 UTC
All these actions remind us of the rule that "the best is always the enemy of the good."
Sometimes users resort to such paranoid settings that they regularly change passwords, phrases, and syllables, which causes great confusion. Since this topic is in the section for beginners, I can advise for those starting their journey here: do not be too inventive; simplicity is sometimes the best solution. Create a seed phrase, write it down in a place where prying eyes cannot see, and that's it; no more witchcraft is needed. Buying a hardware wallet is also a wise decision.
Absolutely agree.

Many of your tried derivation paths aren't common at all and you don't seem to understand the difference between hardened and non-hardened paths. I would suggest to learn a bit about HD wallets and derivation paths here: https://learnmeabitcoin.com/technical/keys/hd-wallets/
Thanks, will do.

Quote
You were once able to restore your funded wallet properly. Why haven't you documented all the steps of restauration, if you're not too familiar with all the technicalities? I've also no idea why you constantly de-install Electrum and delete your wallet file without keeping backups of your wallet file (it should be secured by a strong wallet encryption passphrase anyway). Any good reasons for this?
My idea was to make a wallet, that noone can access even knowing all my passwords and having a physical access to all my belongings. And yes, I was not too familiar with all the technicalities. I was travelling to Cambodia, and Vietnam and wasn't aware these were pretty safe countries.

Quote
BTW, did you download Electrum solely from https://www.electrum.org/#download and verified your download is genuine?
yes, I'm using same version, tried on pc and mac.

Quote
But I'd say, why proceed with a failed BIP39 checksum? Messing with this and a non-default changed derivation path AND  not documented, is fool's territory.
I agree, why would I do it. I think I wanted smth that I can restore if electrum is unavailable, but I was too paranoid to use smth like bitaddress or Coleman's page. That's why I used electrum for a seed generation, and tried if it works, if I switch to BIP39. When it worked and I tested everything with a small amount of money,  I used this method. I just remember I saw the dialog with derivation path, not 100% sure I used it. But I'm almost sure after all the operations I deleted the wallet file, deleted electrum. Then restored everything and exhaled. Then deleted again.

Quote
An additional question that popped up for me: have you re-used your receive address, i.e. do you see your smaller transfer AND your later larger transfer in just one address?
Great question. No. I used "receive" tab, it gave me the address. I didn't even have addresses tab turned on in my view. I was new to Electrum. The second time I was using "receive" tab it gave me another address and I remember I was googling, if it was normal for Electrum to have different recieveing addresses.
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Topic
Board Beginners & Help
Re: Cannot restore my BTC wallet with a seed frase.
by
nodc3
on 02/08/2025, 08:20:11 UTC
~
Let me ask you this, what exactly happened  when you first tested the seed that you had with you,the first attempt..
You mean now, or 5 month ago? 5 month ago I restored the wallet and saw my ballance there.
2 days ago I restored it and the ballance was 0, and the adress was not in the list of adresses of the wallet.
The only way you have your bitcoin back is when the seed phrase you wrote in the paper is all current, what might caused the challenge you are having there, is that you may be inputting a wrong seed phrase, if the address is current and your seed phrase is correct you most see your balance...I will advice you to take your time and look for the address that have the seed phrase you're using to input the seed phrase, secondly check if the seed phrase is the authentic seed phrase for the wallet and again do not do those things under frustration or  pressure, just calm yourself down before you tried it again.
The seed phrase is 100% correct. I think its the derivation path, that I changed.
I currently tried:
m/0'
m/0'/0'
m/0'/0'/0'
m/0'/0'/0'/0'
from m/44'/0'/0' to m/63'/0'/0'
m/0
m/0/0
m/0/0/0
m/0/0/0/0
m/0'/0/0
m/84'/0'/0'
m/84'/0'/1'
m/84'/0'/2'
m/84'/0'/3'
m/84'/0'/4'
m/84'/0'/5'
m/49/0/0
m/47'/0'/0'
m/44h/60h/0h

Any commonly used ones I missed? And can a moderator move this theme to Electrum section? Hopefully I'll get some more advice there.
Any suggestions on a good trustworthy firm, that can help me, if I fail to recover it? Lets just say I had more than one BTC there Sad
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Topic
Board Beginners & Help
Re: Cannot restore my BTC wallet with a seed frase.
by
nodc3
on 01/08/2025, 20:05:09 UTC
Five months ago I created a bitcoin wallet in electrum. I created the seed phrase in electrum (I'm 90% sure) on a macbook. I put a small amount there, deleted the wallet file, deleted electrum. I immediately reinstalled electrum, entered the seed phrase, the wallet was restored, the amount was displayed on the balance. The seed phrase is absolutely correct, I rewrote it many times and remembered it, entered it exactly from a piece of paper. The seed phrase was 12 words without an additional word. I transferred a larger sum there.

After that, I deleted the wallet file. Then restored it. Then deleted it again.

5 months later I am trying to restore it, the balance is 0. I found the address in the blockchain where I transferred the money, btc is there, but this address is not in the list of wallet addresses. I tried to restore the wallet in BlueWallet, it identified the seed phrase as electrum segwit. 0 ballance.

Any ideas what to do now?

This situation can be worrying and annoying at the same time, but let's get something clearer: you said you wrote it many times on different places or just one place? That's my question. If the answer is that you wrote it in different places, do well to compare your seed phrases you wrote down in other places; maybe the one you used to try to gain back access to your electrum wallet after months back might have a bit of an error or differ.

I had printed it in 3 copies, later I copied it to metal plates. I also remember the phrase quite well.
I currently have 2 theories:
1) I for some reason used extended seed phrase (20% chance). Tried all my passwords as a 13th word, tried both electrum native segwit and BIP39.
2) I generated a seed phrase in Electrum. Then recovered the wallet, but using BEP39 option. (80%) I remember I was changing letters "h" for ' in derivation path. Probably I was copying the derivation path from some web article, so it should be smth fairly standard.  Address starts with bc1q, so there are less options. I tried standard derivation paths, nothing worked. (If someone has a list I can manually bruteforce with - I'd be thankful).
Tried checking browser history from that day - nothing, its gone. Tried google activity - nothing that day, prolly used incognito. Tried recovering deleted wallet file on my macbook - nothing. Somehow cannot even recover the one I've deleted today. Going to have some sleep and hope to get more ideas tomorrow. To be honest, I don't get, how I could fk up so bad. I remember I was double checking everything I was doing to be sure I would be able to repeat that.
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Topic
Board Beginners & Help
Re: Cannot restore my BTC wallet with a seed frase.
by
nodc3
on 01/08/2025, 14:52:00 UTC
Electrum does not generate bip39 seed phrases. So, you can only recover your electrum seed phrase using electrum.
I think I started to remember smth. I could generate an electrum seed fraze. Then when restoring selected Bip39 "to check compatibility", ignoring "bip39 checksum failed". Electrum allowes that. (I didn't know it altered adresses). Then probably changed smth in derivation path.
The question is how do I check all derivation paths, knowing seed and 2 adresses.
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Topic
Board Beginners & Help
Re: Cannot restore my BTC wallet with a seed frase.
by
nodc3
on 01/08/2025, 09:33:14 UTC
If you were able to restore wallet using the same seed phrase you had written down originally without any problems, the case shouldn’t be any different even after funding with a good sum.
My best guess is, you have done something to the wallet in your derivation part.

It’s always a garbage in and garbage out for these systems.
How about you don’t try to be any sophisticated and just try to restore a standard wallet, following numeral procedures. You shouldn’t have any problems restoring your wallet address.

I think I tried like 500 times with different parameters in the past 20 hours.
Tried my seed frase on iancoleman.io, it shows "invalid mnemonic".
Looks like its a native Etherium seed frase. That means the only option is - I used an extended seed frase? Because you cannot mess with derivation path, when creating a seed in Etherium. Or am I wrong?
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Board Beginners & Help
Re: Cannot restore my BTC wallet with a seed frase.
by
nodc3
on 01/08/2025, 08:37:47 UTC
There is a chance it was generated outside electrum.
Since you deny any other variant as impossible or very low probability, settle for this thing you said yourself.  If there is a possibility you generated it outside electrum, think which wallets you used.  If I remember properly, wallets like Wasabi Wallet use for example different derivation paths when compared to Electrum.  This does not mean YOU have done something but the wallet may have.

Maybe it is wise to look through lists of wallets and see whether you recognize any of them as one you have used in the past.  Give it a try, at least.  If you recognize one, try the seed in it again.  See if it shows your balance.  But make sure you install the legitimate wallet, verify the files before installing them.  This is so that you do not get scammed out of your wallet by installing malware.

If you have ever used hardware wallets, it is the same situation.  For example, Ledger and Trezor use different derivation paths and I believe you get a different set of addresses if you import the seed phrase of a Trezor in to Electrum with out setting the right derivation path.

Also.  If the two wallet addresses start with bc1q, they are definitely not Legacy.

What I don't get is I allready restored the wallet.
Now I think I could use a 13th word in a seed frase, but I just cannot understand why would I not save it anywhere.
Also I could use LatinAmerican keyboard layout. But I tried it and there was no difference.
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Topic
Board Beginners & Help
Re: Cannot restore my BTC wallet with a seed frase.
by
nodc3
on 01/08/2025, 05:51:40 UTC
Since I know 2 adresses from that wallet, and both start with bc1q, it should be Native Segwit? Should I start bruteforcing different derivatiion paths for that seed frase? What derivation paths generate bc1q adresses? And how do I do it?
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Topic
Board Beginners & Help
Re: Cannot restore my BTC wallet with a seed frase.
by
nodc3
on 01/08/2025, 02:24:02 UTC
I only got one seed frase, I'm sure its right. It was printed on a paper, then carefully rewritten on metal plates. And I remember it.
I'm sure I was able to restore the wallet.
I doubt I'm that dumb to add an extended seed and fully rely on my memory with nothing on my metal plates.
I remember I was trying to create a seed that could be restored in other wallets than electrum. I remember I was clicking (*)Native segwit or smth in Electrum. There is a chance it was generated outside electrum. But I think I settled for electrum seed frase. I even could modify derivation path (very low probability). But I somehow restored it easily.
BTC are still there, I'm 100% sure the adress is mine. I still got a transaction from Trust to that adress in history. Also my keyboard layout could be LatinAmerican at that moment (I tried it, no difference).
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Topic
Board Beginners & Help
Re: Cannot restore my BTC wallet with a seed frase.
by
nodc3
on 31/07/2025, 19:55:14 UTC
My adress starts with bc1q.
I even used wallet.change_gap_limit(200) just in case.
wallet.is_mine gives false. What could I do wrong?
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Topic
Board Beginners & Help
Topic OP
Cannot restore my BTC wallet with a seed frase.
by
nodc3
on 31/07/2025, 17:39:07 UTC
Five months ago I created a bitcoin wallet in electrum. I created the seed phrase in electrum (I'm 90% sure) on a macbook. I put a small amount there, deleted the wallet file, deleted electrum. I immediately reinstalled electrum, entered the seed phrase, the wallet was restored, the amount was displayed on the balance. The seed phrase is absolutely correct, I rewrote it many times and remembered it, entered it exactly from a piece of paper. The seed phrase was 12 words without an additional word. I transferred a larger sum there.

After that, I deleted the wallet file. Then restored it. Then deleted it again.

5 months later I am trying to restore it, the balance is 0. I found the address in the blockchain where I transferred the money, btc is there, but this address is not in the list of wallet addresses. I tried to restore the wallet in BlueWallet, it identified the seed phrase as electrum segwit. 0 ballance.

Any ideas what to do now?