Quote from: RenegadeMan on July 01, 2015, 09:19:41 AM

Quote from: wozzek23 on July 01, 2015, 06:12:06 AM

I hate to sound like a parrot but to me this time is kind of tipping point so allow me to share some more thoughts. I write this out of respect for Mangled Blue, Coins101, Tungfa, Tao, Tante, Renegade Man, qwizzie, Artoodeetoo, toknormal, oaxaca, Minotaur26, Alex-Ru... and several other members whose contributions I admire. Emphasis is on "several" others. I'll get back to it.

Quote from: Mangled Blue on July 01, 2015, 03:03:11 AM

It only goes to show how much we are hated in crypto
DASH actually "does work"
We have over-come HUGE obstacles
I'm sure others could explain many things better but - simple fact - we are hated
A red-headed step-child
Our open-source code will continue to be molested....
...
Face it - CRYPTO HATE US!!!

LONG LIVE DASH!!!!!!!!!!!

I do not care if "crypto hate us" I wonder who LOVES us? There are only 3,045 members on Dash Talk (from 1,850 on November 5th 2014) and here we have only these several people talking among themselves here. And I see this little motley gang of enthusiasts being increasingly delusional. Forgive me this harsh word, I do not use it as negative as it may sound and count me in, regarding that "delusion," because had I had a grain of salt left in my brains I'd leave this dash thingy the very moment it lost its character and became what it is today.

Look at this example, Tao's passionate argument against "some negativity creeping through our normally positive thread," and focus on this bit:

Quote from: TaoOfSaatoshi on July 01, 2015, 04:41:31 AM

We are in this project's infancy. Darksend has its bugs, InstantX does not work every time, and the UI of the wallet could use some work to be more user friendly. What are we in a rush to promote? People download the wallet, say this doesn't do what it's supposed to do and then discard and never come back.

ALL Tao has been doing since commencement of this Twitter et al. activities was to PROMOTE Darkcoin / DASH.

But now he asks "what are we in a rush to promote?" If there was ever a negative statement, that would spook me away this instant, is that sentence. (not to mention that famous ~~Ben Hur~~, promotional video that takes forever) Alas, "WHAT" in it is much worse to me, it frightens me. 18 months into development but the project does not know what it is. Of course no one is buying it. We can all mull over LTC and find gazillion issues with it (I, for one, never got why that thing even existed) but it is CLEAR what LTC is, a "lite" version of BTC.

Discussion, over at Dash Talk about its mission and vision has these two interesting bits:

"Dashs mission is to deliver safe and reliable financial solutions to consumers and merchants in a decentralized manner - providing greater economic freedom to its users."
&
"Vision statement: People and businesses use Dash as digital money for everyday financial transactions."

To which Alex-Ru replied with:

"Dash is about creation of payment system of the future, created by decentralized community to replace current financial system for whole humanity to prosper."

I was screaming from the top of my lungs (as GreyGhost over there at DT) how losing its IDENTITY (as Darkcoin) might kill this technologically great project. Thus far I can't say for sure I was right (after all I still cling on my MN) but every passing day I see that bland, tasteless, wanting to be loved by all but ignored by (almost) everyone DASH as the ONLY one in that crypto space ("that hates us") without its character. Damn it, even that Dogecoin that I do not get at all, or that ripped for pillage Ripple have their IDENTITY but we don't.

I would rather be a laughing stock for a day or a month or even several months and yes, admit a horrible mistake, ditch the DASH name, go back to Darkcoin if I wanted it to be a real, revolutionary financial instrument that focuses on other lunatic fringes all over the world, that need privacy, be it freedom fighters in Tibet struggling against communist destruction of their ancient land, be it supporting Occupy, Snowden or Assange in that other totalitarian system (the U.S.) or to focus on immigrants and displaced all over the world that do not have bank account but have mobile phones (hint) etc., and build it from the scratch or find some other name that would DEFINE IDENTITY of Evan tech vision in two, three, succinct terms, one simple sentence max.

Than we'll have a platform to really push Self-sustainable Decentralized Governance by Blockchain as yet another brilliant idea that can change the world. But hoping to "change the world" from the top (mass adoption delusion) is as deranged as sending a petition to Obama asking him to do "X" or "Y" while you are his (his masters) victim.

And on a personal, gut level, of how I feel about all of this, I sense a paradox of a crypto century. Whomever was pushing re-branding of the name Darkcoin under the false pretense that its name will kill it (coupled with that other wishful thinking of "big retailers" "adopting DASH but not Darkcoin" and "big exchanges" "listing DASH but not Darkcoin," neither of which had happened and is not likely to happen) had created a new name, a lukewarm detergent sounding bland nonsense that might end up killing it instead.

Nomen est omen, do not forget this ancient truth, you children of today, Nomen est omen.

Undecided

You've raised some very salient points Wozzek. As I've stated before, I don't agree with some of your assessments about the name change (as I've previously mentioned, 'Darkcoin' was just never going to be workable for anything other than a very tiny sliver of humanity that would identify with such a brand) but I do appreciate your articulation of (what's becoming clear to me) a somewhat mixed up approach on what it is we have here, and how we're getting the message out.

Tao, while I really appreciate your extraordinary energy and focus on tweeting Dash news, stating "some negativity creeping through our normally positive thread," like it's "bad" I think is poorly characterising an attempt to discuss the reality of the situation. We HAVE TO have open discussions about what's working and what's potentially not. As a contributor to this thread, I don't appreciate being told "quit your belly-aching and put your efforts into supporting the project" when I'm trying to stimulate genuine conversation about what the likely challenge is we're experiencing.

There is clearly a marketing/positioning issue with Dash and it's not going to go away by ignoring it. Some of Wozzek's (effectively) "all things to all people" complaint has validity. The worst thing would be to just ignore him because his view doesn't meet with our group-think view on how we're going to make Dash successful.

Perhaps this isn't the most appropriate forum to discuss this but there's clearly the need to sort through some stuff as I'm of the view there's now some level of confusion as to what Dash is and who it's for.

Actually, I think the project has never had a better focus.

Do one thing and do it well. Digital Cash.

That's the flag at the top of the hill that the project team have stated needs to be captured.

I'd spend money on cleaning up the current logo. It's only about 80% there for my liking. It needs a little more simplification.

Dash is doing what it needs to do at this point. Get really good at doing one thing better than everyone else. From that base you can build an empire.

Bitcoin is looking really strong at this point with Lightning and Side chains. Two innovations that are going to be exceptional when delivered.

What we'll have is Bitcoin and Dash leading the charge against Visa, Mastercard, PayPal, ApplePay, etc. Two strong crypto projects taking on the establishment. You don't have to beat them to win. You just need to be accepted as an option in the landscape to win.

Wallets have slots for several cards. Smartphones with good memory can handle many more wallets. Being one of the best means you rise to the top of that noisy landscape.

I gave up trying to talk about mass adoption, so I'm doing something about it. If you don't go through official channels, you get shit thrown at you. I'm big enough to cope with that. Watch this space.