Quote from: pereira4 on February 14, 2017, 05:04:39 PM

Wrong. Onchain scaling on a decentralized network backed by an huge amount of hashrate to guarantee top tier security while remaining decentralized as bitcoin delivers, will ALWAYS, ALWAYS, ALWAYS lag behind the centralized solutions such as Paypal, VISA, and other centralized payment networks when it comes to speed, cheapness to send the transactions and volume of the transactions. It's a losing game trying to outcompete them onchain in speed, fees and transaction volume, it will never happen, stop being delusional, this is just physics. We NEED a second layer to compete on that field, those are just simple facts of life. Stop being children about it. You can't have it all.

I'm not sure that's true, pereira4. One of the main problems is that commerce on the Internet has come to rely almost exclusively on financial institutions (e.g., Paypay, Visa, etc.) serving as trusted third parties to process electronic payments. While that system works well enough for most transactions, it still suffers from the inherent weaknesses of the trust based model. Completely non-reversible transactions are not really possible, since financial institutions cannot avoid mediating disputes. The cost of mediation increases transaction costs, limiting the minimum practical transaction size and cutting off the possibility for small casual transactions.

So, no, I think Bitcoin will end up cheaper than these centralized alternatives.