Quote from: Ersch on August 06, 2013, 12:52:54 PM

Quote from: vcsmith on August 02, 2013, 05:55:49 PM

I recently received a full refund from BFL for an order I placed several months ago.

I know, I know, BFL claims that "all sales are final". Well, there's "final", and then there's "final"...

It took a month, but here's what worked for me:

I sent an email to office@butterflylabs.com in which I politely requested a refund.
About a week later, I received a reply from BFL denying my request.
I filed a dispute with PayPal. In this dispute I noted that BFL failed to deliver, denied my refund request, and violated PayPal's Terms of Service for pre-order sales.
PayPal closed my dispute the same day, stating that I was outside the 45-day window.
I called PayPal's customer service and complained about my dispute being closed, and explained to PayPal exactly how BFL is violating the ToS.
I sent an email to fraud@paypal.com in which I listed my transaction and dispute number, and explained how BFL is violating the ToS.
A few days later, a PayPal Customer Solutions Supervisor called me on the phone. He had already spoken to BFL and assured me that BFL would be contacting me. I told him that I just wanted a refund, and explained to him how BFL is violating the ToS.
I waited a week to give BFL plenty of time to contact me. They didn't.
I emailed the PayPal Customer Solutions Supervisor and told him that BFL had not contacted me. He seemed shocked. I wasn't. He told me that PayPal could take action against BFL if necessary.
The PayPal Customer Solutions Supervisor escalated my dispute to the next level (whatever that is). He told me that someone else would call.
The next day I received a call from a guy named Bruce at BFL. He told me that since I had complained to PayPal, BFL was placing my order "under review" and taking it out of the queue. From his tone, I got the impression that Bruce thought this would bother me. I told him that I didn't need a review, I just wanted my money back. He wouldn't give me a firm answer and just kept repeating that they were placing my order "under review" and taking it out of the queue. I even asked if this review would take a day, week, month, or year. No answer, just the same "under review" statement.
Within 5 minutes of BFL's call, an Account Representative from PayPal called. I told her about the strange conversation with Bruce. She said that she would contact BFL again.
My payment to BFL was refunded to my PayPal account the next business day.

IMHO, this is the bottom line:

BFL needs PayPal. If you want your money back, complain to PayPal and don't give up.

just a feedback on my paypal claim, it is the answer:

Quote

When you pay with PayPal, you have buyer protection till 45 days after the tranaction been made. I see that you tried to open a claim. Because of the above reason this case got automaticly closed directly.

I'm very sorry to inform you that we can't do anything about this matter. Even when the seller informs you that the delivery time can take up till 2 months, you should have opened a claim before the 45 days.

As you paid with your balance, you also have no option to claim the payment back by the creditcard company or the bank.

The only thing you could you, is go to the police. The police can contact us and we can inform him about the account information.

Please let us know if you require any further assistance.

Chargeback your credit card and they'll rip the funds from paypal.