Quote from: franky1 on August 13, 2025, 01:53:55 PM

Quote from: DaRude on August 13, 2025, 01:23:14 AM

Wow So in your mind Israel can put a territory under total blockade,

every country has borders and the designated customs/border crossings

Quote from: DaRude on August 13, 2025, 01:23:14 AM

use its military to stop all incoming food and water, even prevent UN and red cross from bringing food and medicine into the territory, and then claim that it has no lawful duty to supply said territory with aid,

every country has border checks. isreal have not stooped other countries. they just customs check the supplies dont have weapons/banned thing smuggled in.. UN could deliver checked goods into gaza but no UN dont want to step foot into gaza, they want hamas to control aid within the border.. but hamas are too cowardly to come to the border, so UN aid just stays at the border. the UN dont want other aid agencies handling UN aid either
the UN doesnt want isreal or ghf doing sparate food aid, but isreal/ghf still do even when legally they dont have to and warned by UN not to

Quote from: DaRude on August 13, 2025, 01:23:14 AM

did i understand that correctly? Following your logic to it's conclusion, you believe that until Gaza fully capitulates Israel has a right to starve them all to death, and that will be totally "legal"? What great interpretations for any madman that wants to starve a lot of people. You should collect them all together and put them in the book titled, "How to justify famine and murdering civilians for psychopaths".

you really are deluded.. UN/hamas do not want lots of random countries helping out.. the UN say only hamas should be handling the aid within gaza
eqypt stopped helping directly as it would escalate them into the war, after all egypt owned gaza for a long time in history, so do not want a repeat

hack we also see the houthi's destroying ships heading towards the region so they are not ones wanting to feed gaza. and i have not seen iran try to send stuff inwards thats not weaponery. even though they are the main funders of hamas. where is irans humanitarian effort?
iran are abusing the palestinians and using hamas for irans end goal of re-igniting the persian empire

isreal/US is the only ones willing to take the risk to send aid in even against UN's preferences.. even the UN itself refuse to step across the border.. they just leave aid at the border..
isreal have sent more aid in than the population needs.. enough that if it was distributed and not hoarded at hamas warehouses. would be enough calories to feed 2m people until mid 2026

why are you so blind to what happens to the aid once inside the border. why are you too afraid to look at what hamas does once they organise ambushes of aid trucks en-route to distribution centres. 85% of aid never reaches the distribution centres because its ambushed en-route
why are you too afraid to look into that stuff.. oh wait it will involve you saying something negative about hamas. and you are too afriad to say bad things about hamas

Quote from: DaRude on August 13, 2025, 01:23:14 AM

Yes i cannot think of a better way for Israel to get peaceful Palestinians. I bet right after burying their mothers and watching their sisters starve to death, every Palestinian kid would want nothing more than to express his love for Israel! Solid logic, everyone believes that right?

again you keep switching the word from hamas troops and their families/associates. to try to make it sound like innocent random palestinian.. see how bad you are at separating to two.. heck you cant even see the difference. and thats why you are blind and stupid in these discussions

Quote from: DaRude on August 13, 2025, 01:23:14 AM

If Hamas is the occupying power, can you please educate us on who's the de jure and de facto government in Gaza? Something telling me that you won't answer this one as well.

hamas are in power i told you already !!!!
hamas are in power i told you already !!!!
stop being blind to the word hamas. realise their agenda, realise how they differ to normal civilians and other arabs/muslims.. stop being blind to hamas, stop trying to avoid hamas's actions

Quote from: DaRude on August 13, 2025, 01:23:14 AM

"aid was supose to be for the palestinians not hamas" Can you entertain us on how distributors of aid should differentiate between Hamas and Palestinians? If Hamas are not Palestinians what ethnic group are they? Great attempt at justification to keep region in famine.

quick translations
hamas=extremist terror plotting soldiers with the motto "deal to isreal, death to america" mostly wear black with green bandana on forehead on duty
palestinians = normal citizens

your problem is you want to pretend that hamas are the same as palestinians, even though hamas follow the credence of the iranian regime of actual genocide
palestinians are the normal civilians that just want a family, work and home.. a normal life, they wear normal middle eastern casual wear

this is why many countries want hamas removed, disarmed and depowered. and instead have gaza governed by a peaceful palestinian state power

when the food that is destined for distribution sites, gets ambushed, look into who organised the ambushes, then look at where 85% of food ends up that should have got to palestinians for free

Quote from: DaRude on August 13, 2025, 01:23:14 AM

Like i said many times i believe that Hamas committed acts of terrorism, i also believe that Israel is currently committing war crimes and crimes against humanity. Both are terrible, but Israel is operating on a completely different level/scale, and is sponsored by the US/EU, making a public mockery for the rule of law and setting a terrible precedent. Look China you can blockade Taiwan and let them all starve to death and US/EU will think it's totally fine/legal.

the blockade is not due to palestinians vs isreali's its due to hamas vs isrealis
isreal want peace with palestinians. isreal have fundamentally be the main ones writing peace deals and accords with palestinians and other arab nations.. its however the extremist terror groups that have a strong hold and working as a taken over government that then cause chaos for those involved
hamas declined many efforts for peace,

YOU and those like you keep trying to tar innocent palestinians with the same brush as hamas.. every time something involved hamas you call it out as a palestinian thing. you and others like you keep pretending that palestinians are the intended targets and everything in your eyes needs to make it look like a palestinian thing and not mention hamas

Quote from: DaRude on August 13, 2025, 01:23:14 AM

ohh wow, so now we're separating civilians, women and children into "true innocent unaffiliated people" and not so trully innocent civilians? Should Israel identify "absolute innocent bystanders" by measuring their skulls?

isreal have intelliagence they know where the hamas targets are, that is who they are targetting. they airdrop loads of leaflets if the area is a civilian area to get the civilians a chance to move out away from hamas known locations.. those that dont move from hamas will evidently become collateral damage.. butif you look at whom these refusals to move people are, they are the family or strong neighbours of hamas

it doesnt need measuring skulls.. you are delusional.. what you got to realise is isreal does all it can to warn normal innocents that hamas have infiltrated their neighbourhood/civilian infrastructure, causing the area to become a battleground. isreal give time for civilians to disperse
what you are not admitting to want to know is hamas dont warn the area that hamas need to use the area. hamas dont tell citizens they will be safer if the moved out
try to learn why hamas want and demand and threaten civilians to stay, even their own family they dont ask them to leave for safety

i never have been, but if i was a military guy. i would not want my family living with me in the same building that i do my military actions. i would not use my family or neighbours as human shields. if my family got shot in the location im doing military actions, id feel guilty that i put them in harms way, i would not blame others. its called war, if i knew an area is a battle field i would want civilians to move out the way, i would not want my family, friends or neighbour in the firing line
you however, by reading a few of your posts seem to be of the ideals of wanting family in the battlefield with you

hamas dont want to build battle fields in wastelands at the borders away from civilians. they want to hide in civilian area's they want to use their family and neighbours as human shields.
those that voluntarily stay want to become martyrs because they believe in the hamas cause.. and thats what makes them different to innocent palestinians.. not skull sizes

Quote from: DaRude on August 13, 2025, 01:23:14 AM

And after getting yourself in yet another corner, you're now just unable to answer if you support more governments recognizing Palestinian state at the UN in September?

with the terms that come with that recognition
disarm hamas demilitarise hamas, get new election process to replace hamas with a peaceful palestinian authority
then yes gaza has ancient historic recognition from the ancient days of the philistines to call gaza palestine and be governed by a peaceful palestinian government
(ive said this already but i know you ignored it because i mentioned remove hamas, which you dislike, so ignored entirely)

countries previously have not wanted to recognise gaza as a palestinian state because its currently controlled by a extremist terror group(hamas) under the umbrella of the iranian regime

Once again your little story has a fatal flaw which you're just refusing to address. If Hamas has enough food to last whole Palestine until year 3036 why not allow UN bring more food in and do with it as they wish? According to your logic HAMAS is swimming in food, so additional food wouldn't be of any benefit to HAMAS, then why prevent UN from delivering it? Why can't Israel just say that from now on UN can bring as much food and water as they wish, they can flood whole Gaza with baby formula?

"it will involve you saying something negative about hamas. and you are too afriad to say bad things about hamas" in your monomaniacal state of defeating Israel at all costs you seemed to have lost all of you reading comprehension abilities Like i said many times i believe that Hamas committed acts of terrorism, i also believe that Israel is currently committing war crimes and crimes against humanity. Both are terrible, but Israel is operating on a completely different level/scale, and is sponsored by the US/EU, making a public mockery for the rule of law and setting a terrible precedent. Look China you can blockade Taiwan and let them all starve to death and US/EU will think it's totally fine/legal.

"again you keep switching the word from hamas troops and their families/associates. to try to make it sound like innocent random palestinian.. see how bad you are at separating to two.. heck you cant even see the difference. and thats why you are blind and stupid in these discussions"
It's quiet obvious that by your definition there are no more Palestinians in Gaza, because i doubt a single one of them wishes peace upon Israel now. Which coincidentally works out for Israel, if we declare everyone that doesn't like us as terrorists, then we can destroy all terrorists...

Quote from: https://ihl-databases.icrc.org/en/ihl-treaties/api-1977/article-50

Article 50 - Definition of civilians and civilian population
1. A civilian is any person who does not belong to one of the categories of persons referred to in Article 4 A (1), (2), (3) and (6) of the Third Convention and in Article 43 of this Protocol. In case of doubt whether a person is a civilian, that person shall be considered to be a civilian.
2. The civilian population comprises all persons who are civilians.
3. The presence within the civilian population of individuals who do not come within the definition of civilians does not deprive the population of its civilian character.

Ugh that annoying Geneva convention again. So in the whole world civilians are defined essentially as all individuals who do not belong to the armed forces or combatant categories. And civilians should be protected under Geneva convention. But what you're saying is that Israelis are some super race above Palestinians because they can treat Palestinians differently from all other humans? Instead Israel should be allowed to administer it's own purity test which would created different classes of Palestinian civilians "what makes them different to innocent palestinians.. not skull sizes" and "true innocent unaffiliated people". How should those civilians who are non combatants but don't pass Israeli's civilian purity test be separated from "innocent unaffiliated civilians"? Have you considering tattooing some numbers on them for easy identification? Hitler would've been so proud of you!