Quote from: paxmao on October 03, 2022, 11:43:14 PM

Quote from: DaRude on October 02, 2022, 07:46:26 AM

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December is only 2 months away, if the political will to buy RU gas will build up come winter but now Germany will be forced to buy RU gas through Ukraine, will you admit then that you were wrong in your assessment and that it definitely would've been much easier if Germany could arrange for deliveries through NS directly without involving UA?

But then again your covered yourself nicely with assertion of RU acting in irrational manner. That's a nice cover to literally explain any and all possible actions that disadvantage RU as doing of RU itself...

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You need to read more carefully - in what you or I would think is irrational. The Mafia world has its own rules.

No, if Germany buys gas from RF through any means that Adolf Putin is desperate enough to sell gas to EU - nothing else - it makes no difference to the point.

If Ukraine falls under the influence of the Orcs Adolf holds the key, if not Ukraine is a partner in the EU. In any of those cases, Germany should have learnt the lesson and have a plan B in the future to avoid being blackmailed by RF or, if it really should come to it in a million years, by Ukraine.

Germany has made a mistake when appreciating the real control and reliability of Adolf Putin as a commercial partner. They should know better in the future, even if they decide to keep using cheap RF gas, they will need the plan B and a progressive energetic transition (which is anyway needed).

"Adolf Putin is desperate enough to sell gas to EU" so Putin would be desperate to sell gas and Germany would help him out by buying it, because the rules of the mafia world? And knowing that beforehand, he blows up his own direct pipeline to Germany so they'd have to ask permission and pay Ukraine or Poland to transfer more gas to Germany? Did i understand you correctly?

As far as US pushing EU to diversify its energy resources from RU, now you're starting to open up your eyes, think macro level and ask very dangerous questions. Careful, real world is not pretty and dangerous questions might lead to disillusionment and why everyone cares about Ukraine all of a sudden.

April 2008

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President Bush threw the NATO summit meeting here off-script on Wednesday by lobbying hard to extend membership to Ukraine and Georgia, but he failed to rally support for the move among key allies.
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Mr. Bush’s position — that Ukraine and Georgia should be welcomed into a Membership Action Plan, or MAP, that prepares nations for NATO membership — directly contradicted German and French government positions stated earlier this week. It also risked upsetting efforts to get Russia to soften its opposition to positioning a missile defense array in Eastern Europe.
Mr. Bush failed to win over a consensus of NATO members in a debate at a dinner of NATO leaders, a senior German official said Wednesday night, with at least seven countries lined up against him.
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As Mr. Bush did more often early in his presidency, he expressed his views candidly despite warnings from allies that he was complicating efforts to find diplomatic solutions.
Normally, summit meetings like this are prescripted, but Mr. Bush’s comments added some extra interest while annoying Germany and France, which had said they would block the invitation to Ukraine and Georgia.
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and officials were asked to find some construction overnight that would encourage Ukraine and Georgia without asking them to enter a membership plan now.
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Some German officials described the German chancellor, Angela Merkel, as upset and even angry on Wednesday. She and Mr. Bush have talked repeatedly about the issue in the past two months.

https://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/03/world/europe/03nato.html

August 2008

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Georgia's oil pipeline is key to U.S. support
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Georgia's pipeline: It allows the West to reduce its reliance on Middle Eastern oil, bypassing Russia and Iran
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There is more than meets the eye to the frantic U.S. efforts Friday to talk Russia and American ally Georgia out of war over an obscure mountain tract most Americans have never heard of.
A look at the map and your gas credit card bill shows why.
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The breakaway province of South Ossetia is claimed by Georgia, a former Soviet republic that cast its lot with the United States and the West to the eternal irritation of Moscow. But South Ossetia has resisted Georgia's rule and has been under Russia's sway for years.
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A U.S.-backed oil pipeline runs through Georgia, allowing the West to reduce its reliance on Middle Eastern oil while bypassing Russia and Iran.
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The pipeline that crosses Georgia can pump slightly more than 1 million barrels of crude oil per day, or more than 1 percent of the world's daily crude output. The 1,100-mile pipeline carries oil from Azerbaijan's Caspian Sea fields, estimated to hold the world's third-largest reserves.
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Most of the oil is bound for Western Europe, where gas prices are even higher than the $4 and more a gallon that U.S. consumers are now paying. With only so much oil to go around, what the pipeline carries affects prices elsewhere. The United States also hopes it will be a model for other development projects that could have a more direct effect on the U.S. market.
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U.S diplomats refer to these neighborhood squabbles as "frozen conflicts," a euphemism that belies the long-recognized threat that seemingly petty disputes can easily provoke a wider war.

https://www.sfgate.com/news/article/Georgia-s-oil-pipeline-is-key-to-U-S-support-3201499.php

Now take a wild guess which country holds/held? the second largest gas reserves in Europe after Norway and transited more natural gas than any other country in the world? Here's a hint The Yuzivska gas field is an unconventional Ukrainian natural gas field that was discovered in 2010...Region: Donetsk Oblast Kharkiv Oblast

And in 2013 we have American cookies in Ukraine supporting the coup against RU leaning UA president

What amazing coincidences, ok so if RU is #1 in world gas reserves, lets check on who is #2, I'm sure things must be amazing there right no... oh right it's Iran, July 27, 2022 Iran’s natural gas exports revenues in the four months to late July have exceeded figures reported for the entire calendar year to March what a great time to start worrying about women rights there, can someone ask Saudis not to stone any women to death or dismember any journalist this month?